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Old April 24th, 2010, 07:36 PM
t.pettet t.pettet is offline
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Food for crf cat

She is a nine yr. old persian mix and has just been diagnosed. Any suggestions appreciated.
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Old April 25th, 2010, 01:50 AM
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Do you have her bloodwork & urine numbers? BUN/Urea, creatinine, phosphorus, potassium, calcium & Urine Specific Gravity...

Canned food is an absolute must, no dry food, stay away from fish varieties as much as possible, fish as a 2nd or 3rd protein source is okay though. Adding a teaspoon or two of water to the canned is also good to keep her hydrated. Lots of fresh water.

For non-prescription canned foods Evo 95% Chicken & Turkey, Evo 95% Beef, Evo 95% Venison, Wellness Chicken, Wellness Turkey, Wellness Beef & Chicken, Wellness Kitten, Felidae Chicken & Rice all have good numbers. Some of the Merricks, Eagle Pack Holisitic Select are also have low-ish numbers I'd have to look up which ones. Friskies Fine Cuts w/Chicken in gravy, Friskies Seared Filets with Turkey and Giblets, Friskies Special Diet Sliced Chicken in Gravy Dinner all have decent numbers.

http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=45017

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Old April 25th, 2010, 07:05 PM
t.pettet t.pettet is offline
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Food for crf

Thank you Growler. Polly is a client's cat and spent 2 days at vets getting re-hydrated so sorry I don't have her levels but will pass your info along.
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Old April 26th, 2010, 01:16 AM
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Merrick Cowboy Cookout and Merrick Thanksgiving Day Dinner have numbers that are decent. Eagle Pack no longer lists phos levels on their site so I can't tell if they've changed formulas with the change in packaging.

Depending on how your client feels about the ingredients in Vet Prescription foods, that is another way to go. Unfortunately these prescription foods are fairly limited in protein levels which sometimes lead to the cats not interested in eating it.

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Old April 27th, 2010, 08:41 PM
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My cat also is crf -diagnosed in December - I've tried the k/d, Medical Reduced Protein, and Purina NF - rotating them because Schweppie gets sick of food so quickly. According to my vet, she said that the companies have to use alternative sources of protein like corn so that it doesn't add phosphorus. I guess it's a matter of keeping the kidney levels steady.

So then I was reading Dr. Pitcairn's book Natural Health for Dogs and Cats and found a recipe for cats with kidney disease. There is a website that lists some homemade recipes along with Dr. Pitcairn's. However, I seem to have forgotten what the url is. Google 'homemade food for cats with kidney disease" and you should find it. Sorry, I don't even remember what the site's name is (i have it on my laptop but I'm not home and I don't have internet access there).

Growler, what numbers are you referring to? I'm guessing protein and phosphorus....but can you tell me the ranges that are good for crf cats that we should be looking for in a food?

You can use phosphorus binders and probably eventually, you will have to give him benazapril (the brand name is Fortekor) - which is normally used for heart problems in people but has been shown to slow the reduction of kidney function in cats and dogs. It is an ACE inhibitor. Cats with crf also get upset tummies so your vet will probably prescribe famotidine (brand name Pepcid AC). Also, if your cat;s appetite slows significantly, your vet will probably get you to administer subcutaneous fluids at home to keep your cat hydrated.

It is also important to maintain your cat's weight at an ideal range. don't allow him to lose weight and if he's not eating, you may have to force feed him with a syringe.

Some vets will also prescribe Azodyl which is a probiotic- but I think the vets that do are more on the 'integrative medicine' side as opposed to the allopathic side. I personally am interested in Azodyl and will be looking into giving it to my cat.

Back to the food, I've read that it's not the protein that is the big issue, it's more the phosphorus. With crf cats, you'll see muscle wasting so the theory is if you reduce the protein, the more muscle wasted so to speak. So the obective is to give high quality protein while controlling the phosphorus. Eggs are a source of high quality protein without adding phosphorus so giving your cat some scrambled eggs will do him some good.

Encourage drinking - get a drinking fountain - whatever it takes. The point is to flush the kidneys and avoid extra stress on them.

I'm sorry about the diagnosis but with care and diligence, your cat can live a normal life for a number of years.
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Last edited by flipgirl4; April 27th, 2010 at 08:42 PM. Reason: correction
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Old April 29th, 2010, 02:19 AM
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Originally Posted by flipgirl4 View Post
Growler, what numbers are you referring to? I'm guessing protein and phosphorus....but can you tell me the ranges that are good for crf cats that we should be looking for in a food?
Phosphorus is the number I was refering to, protein levels I was not concerned with as the food I was feeding was all high quality protein canned or raw. When you have high quality protein there is less waste phosphorus in the blood than a low quality protein, if you drop the protein levels too low such as using corn etc without meat, the taste of the food significantly drops as well making the food less palatable to the often finicky cat.

Duffy never had any issue with her blood phosphorus level it was always middle of normal, so I wasn't overly concerned with finding the absolute lowest phos food, more about her taste & what she'd eat.

There are two ways of looking at the phosphorus content of food:

On a mg phos/100 kcal scale you want phos around or lower than 200mg/kcal energy.

Not all foods available to you will be listed here as this was put together by volunteer submissions: http://binkyspage.tripod.com/CanFoodNew.html

On a dry matter basis (not the as fed listing on the can) you want as close to or lower than 1% dry matter phos.

For this you need more than the guareented analysis you need a complete nutrient analysis like this one from Evo 95% Chicken & Turkey that shows everything. Most companies don't list the phosphorus levels on their cans or websites anymore, so emailing those manufactures directly is an option, one I did use with great success with Wellness.

Once you have the as fed phos listing from the nutrient analysis you need to convert it to dry matter to acurately compare between brands/flavours as the formulas differ slightly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by flipgirl4 View Post
Some vets will also prescribe Azodyl which is a probiotic- but I think the vets that do are more on the 'integrative medicine' side as opposed to the allopathic side. I personally am interested in Azodyl and will be looking into giving it to my cat.
Duffy was on Azodyl for 4 months before she passed away (unrelated Lymphoma), her test results showed the drop in both BUN & Crea since we had started it, it is something I would recommend . http://www.vetoquinolusa.com/pages/pro_azodyl.html
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Old April 29th, 2010, 03:37 PM
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Thank you for the info growler. From me and Schweppie! When I told my vet about me feeding a homemade diet, she didn't really like the idea because the calcium and phosphorus ratio can be messed up. Then she said that the reason why hill's and other rx companies use corn is because they need a good source of protein without adding the extra phosphorus. But in light of what you said, this shouldn't make a difference if the protein is of high quality. So it makes me wonder if they add corn for the protein or for the price.
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Old May 1st, 2010, 12:19 AM
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I'm sure the corn would make the phos very low in the food, however the cats can't use that protein source as efficiently as real meat for building/maintaining muscle mass.

Just watch the blood protein, phosphorus, calcuim levels to be sure they are not rising above/dropping below normal levels, and if they start to you can take measures to correct them.

Some info here on protein and CRF cats http://www.felinecrf.org/nutritional...ts.htm#protein
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Old May 1st, 2010, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flipgirl4 View Post
Thank you for the info growler. From me and Schweppie! When I told my vet about me feeding a homemade diet, she didn't really like the idea because the calcium and phosphorus ratio can be messed up. Then she said that the reason why hill's and other rx companies use corn is because they need a good source of protein without adding the extra phosphorus. But in light of what you said, this shouldn't make a difference if the protein is of high quality. So it makes me wonder if they add corn for the protein or for the price.
I believe that egg whites (slightly cooked) can be added to homemade raw food to keep the phosphorus levels down while still keeping quality protein levels up.

Corn for protein for cats , awww man, when will vets realize that cats are carnivores and should have meat for their protein source.
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Old May 1st, 2010, 09:00 PM
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Originally Posted by flipgirl4 View Post
Thank you for the info growler. From me and Schweppie! When I told my vet about me feeding a homemade diet, she didn't really like the idea because the calcium and phosphorus ratio can be messed up. .
Funny...the k/d chicken wet diet has a Cal:Phos ratio of nearly 1.71:1. Pretty high if you ask me (although is it within the AAFCO acceptable range). And yep on the egg whites...I just made up a batch of homemade bone-free raw food for Boo today, first try. It had eggs in it (raw yolk and lightly cooked whites). I have to tinker with the recipe still, so I'm not quite ready to share...I will when I'm more comfy, but this was my first attempt.
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