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  #31  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 04:17 PM
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i totally mean well

one dog, a hundred diet possibilities, life's good!
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  #32  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 04:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by technodoll
i totally mean well
I think that's like "cool" where you can't say it about yourself.
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  #33  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 04:44 PM
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I'm sure you do mean well, thanks for the tip. However, as a scientist, I would rather look at real scientific data than go by what is said on a website sponsored by a company selling pet food (that link is not a scientific article, but maybe there are some you are referring to). I guess i don't see where science makes a guarantee here for anything. But, I haven't had time to look around for articles and was merely observing my own dog. I am somewhat worried about excessive anxious panting, it wasn't 'good' energy, but more like alarming, so I switched. He does seem a bit less anxious now, but I could be imagining things, or he could have had something else going on, who knows. Are there some other references you have found (not a website, but articles in peer-reviewed journals)? I'm sorry if this comes across as being rude or something, people sometimes get me wrong as well. I wonder if there are more accessible B-vitamins in this Evo Red meat. Certainly in humans vitamins like B12 can cause such a reaction (higher energy level).
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  #34  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 05:21 PM
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Unfortunately you can't have science without the food company in the dog food business. The food companies are the only ones with the money for research.
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  #35  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 05:38 PM
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it sure is hard to break into those university studies like prin said, the petfood companies are the ones with $$$... dunno how much to trust them since studies are often biased. i'd love to see some data on high-protein diets, any data. so far all i've found, is stuff we already know if anyone has knowledge to share... big ears here!
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  #36  
Old October 3rd, 2006, 06:18 PM
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The only major ones I know of are the Purina ones (the ones that said seniors do better on more protein).
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  #37  
Old October 4th, 2006, 08:10 AM
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Well ... my 11 month old ES pup is doing extremely well on SG's Barking at the Moon (46% protein?)

His coat's good, his energy isn't any different, poop is smaller & he's slowly put on weight. Now he's slender instead of skinny. His appetite is betterr on this food too, making him less inclined to kibble snub.

He's also nicely muscled.

He's been on it since mid-august nd I'm pretty happy so far. I was mixing it with a lower protein kibble but he's less inclined the eat then.
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  #38  
Old October 4th, 2006, 10:05 AM
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I usually take nutritional studies with a grain of salt, as it seems like they do have a lot of bias, and not necessarily because of the pet food companies funding them. Funding from them isn't necessarily going to skew the results in their favor. However, looking through some of the papers, you see that a lot of the studies are done w/ small sample numbers (I saw one with only 4 dogs, but most seem to have more like 20 and usually beagles although sometimes greyhounds) and only one type of dog. Will these results translate to everyone's dog? Doubtful. It is like clinical studies on humans. For years, most studies were done on white men and the results assumed to be the same for all other population groups. We are seeing now that women metabolize some drugs differently, and then you have to consider that each person and dog has their own body chemistry, so won't necessarily follow the 'norm'. I haven't found too much on behavior and high protein diet in dogs, but will post a sampling of abstracts found in pubmed. Only a couple were behavior related, the others I just thought were interesting.

Sorry, this will be long:
Chemical composition, protein quality, palatability, and digestibility of alternative protein sources for dogs.
J Anim Sci. 2005 Oct;83(10):2414-22.
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, Urbana, 61801, USA.
The chemical composition and protein quality of 11 alternative protein sources (chicken products, blood products, enzyme-hydrolyzed fish protein concentrate, soybean meal, and spray-dried pork liver) were determined, and an experiment was conducted to determine palatability and digestibility of processed red blood cell-containing diets. Chicken protein sources differed in concentrations of CP, acid-hydrolyzed fat, and total AA (TAA) by 20, 31, and 24%, respectively, and GE by 1.7 kcal/g. Blood protein sources varied little in acid-hydrolyzed fat and GE concentrations, but concentrations of CP and TAA differed by 11 and 8%, respectively. Protein solubility of chicken and blood protein source categories averaged 57 and 69%, respectively. Protein solubility of enzyme-hydrolyzed fish protein concentrate, soybean meal, and spray-dried pork liver was 53, 67, and 26%, respectively. Based on calculations from immobilized digestive enzyme assay values, lysine digestibility averaged approximately 80.4 and 81.7% for blood and chicken protein sources, respectively. Lysine digestibility values for soybean meal and spray-dried pork liver were 89 and 77%, respectively. A chick protein efficiency ratio (PER) assay showed that chicken protein sources had high protein quality values, as the PER ranged from 2.7 to 5.3, whereas blood protein sources had poor protein quality (PER values less than 1.5). Enzyme-hydrolyzed fish protein concentrate, spray-dried pork liver, and soybean meal had high protein quality (PER values greater than 2.8). In the dog palatability and digestibility experiments, a corn and chicken-based diet supplemented with either 0 or 3% processed red blood cells was tested. The palatability test showed that dogs consumed more of the diet that contained 0% vs. 3% processed red blood cells. The intake ratio for the 3% processed red blood cells diet was 0.34. Nutrient digestibilities did not differ, except for CP, where the digestibility was greater (P = 0.01) for dogs consuming the 0% processed red blood cells diet. These data suggest that chemical composition and quality of alternative protein sources differ greatly among ingredients within the same category. Palatability data suggest that a processed red blood cells-containing diet is not highly palatable but, when this diet was offered as only one food, dogs demonstrated no aversion response but some decrease in protein digestion.


Fish meals, fish components, and fish protein hydrolysates as potential ingredients in pet foods.
Anim Sci. 2006 Oct;84(10):2752-65.
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, Urbana, Illinois 61801, USA.
An experiment to determine the chemical composition and protein quality of 13 fish substrates (pollock by-products, n = 5; fish protein hydrolysates, n = 5; and fish meals, n = 3) was conducted. Two of these substrates, salmon protein hydrolysate (SPH) and salmon meal with crushed bones (SMB), were used to determine their palatability as components of dog diets. Pollock by-products differed in concentrations of CP, crude fat, and total AA by 71, 79, and 71%, respectively, and GE by 4.1 kcal/g. Fish protein hydrolysates and fish meals were less variable (approximately 18, 14, and 17%, and 1.4 kcal/g, respectively). Biogenic amine concentrations were much higher in fish protein hydrolysates as compared with pollock by-products and fish meals. Pollock liver and viscera had the highest total fatty acid concentrations; however, red salmon hydrolysate and SMB had the highest total PUFA concentrations (49.63 and 48.60 mg/g, respectively). Salmon protein hydrolysate had the highest protein solubility in 0.2% KOH. Based on calculations using immobilized digestive enzyme assay values, lysine digestibility of fish meal substrates was comparable to in vivo cecectomized rooster assay values and averaged approximately 90.3%. Also, pollock milt, pollock viscera, red salmon hydrolysate, and sole hydrolysate had comparable values as assessed by immobilized digestive enzyme assay and rooster assays. A chick protein efficiency ratio (PER) assay compared SMB and SPH to a whole egg meal control and showed that SMB had high protein quality (PER = 3.5), whereas SPH had poor protein quality (PER value less than 1.5). However, using whole egg meal as the reference protein, both fish substrates were found to be good protein sources with an essential AA index of 1.0 and 0.9 for SMB and SPH, respectively. In the dog palatability experiments, a chicken-based control diet and 2 diets containing 10% of either SPH or SMB were tested. Dogs consumed more of the SPH diet compared with the control, and similar amounts of the SMB and control diets. The intake ratios for each were 0.73 and 0.52, respectively. Salmon protein hydrolysate was especially palatable to dogs. These data suggest that chemical composition and nutritional quality of fish substrates differ greatly and are affected by the specific part of the fish used to prepare fish meals and fish protein hydrolysates.

Influence of obesity on plasma lipid and lipoprotein concentrations in dogs.
Am J Vet Res. 2005 Jan;66(1):81-6.
Affinity-Petcare, 08174, Barcelona, Spain
OBJECTIVE: To determine effects of obesity and diet in dogs on plasma lipid and lipoprotein concentrations by assaying plasma leptin and ghrelin concentrations and determining total plasma cholesterol and triglyceride concentrations as well as the concentrations of cholesterol and triglycerides in various lipoprotein classes (ie, very-low-density, low-density, and high-density lipoproteins). ANIMALS: 24 Beagles; 12 lean (mean [+/- SEM] body weight, 12.7 +/- 0.7 kg) and 12 chronically obese (21.9 +/- 0.8 kg) dogs of both sexes, between 1 and 9 years old. PROCEDURES: Total plasma cholesterol and triglyceride concentrations; lipoprotein cholesterol and triglyceride concentrations; and plasma ghrelin, leptin, free fatty acids, insulin, and glucose concentrations were measured and compared between lean and obese dogs, both of which were fed a complete and balanced maintenance diet. Chronically obese dogs were subsequently fed a high-protein low-energy diet to evaluate effects of diet composition on plasma lipid and lipoprotein measurements. RESULTS: Chronic obesity resulted in a significant decrease in plasma ghrelin concentration and a significant increase in plasma leptin, cholesterol, and triglyceride concentrations in dogs. High total plasma cholesterol and triglyceride concentrations resulted from increased cholesterol and triglyceride concentrations in all lipoprotein fractions. In obese dogs, modification of diet composition resulted in beneficial effects on plasma lipid and leptin concentrations, even before weight loss was observed. CONCLUSIONS AND CLINICAL RELEVANCE: Correlations exist between obesity and plasma measurements (ie, lipoproteins, leptin, insulin, and ghrelin) commonly associated with obesity. Modification of diet composition to control energy intake improves plasma lipid and leptin concentrations in obese dogs.

Corn hybrid affects in vitro and in vivo measures of nutrient digestibility in dogs.
J Anim Sci. 2005 Jan;83(1):160-71.
Department of Animal Sciences, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign, Urbana 61801, USA.
Corn is a commonly used ingredient in dry pet foods because there is a stable supply and it is a relatively inexpensive source of nutrients. Corn hybrids are available that are higher in CP and amylose and lower in phytate concentration than conventional hybrids. Approximately 500 mg of high-protein (HP), high-protein, low-phytate (HPLP), and high-amylose (HA) corn were compared with conventional (CONV) corn and amylomaize starch (AM) in triplicate and exposed to pepsin/hydrochloric acid and pancreatin to simulate hydrolytic digestion. Substrate remaining after this was used to determine in vitro colonic fermentation. Organic matter disappearances as a result of hydrolytic digestion were >80% for CONV, HP, and HPLP, whereas HA (60.7%) and AM (43.7%) were lower (P < 0.05). Total digestion (TD) values after hydrolytic digestion and 8 h of fermentation using canine fecal inoculum were greater (P < 0.05) for CONV, HP, and HPLP vs. HA and AM. The residue left after hydrolytic digestion of all substrates was poorly fermented. Five ileal-cannulated dogs were fed each corn hybrid at approximately 31% of the diet in a 5 x5 Latin square design. Dogs fed diets containing HP corn had higher (P < 0.05) ileal OM digestibility (70.3%) and tended (P < 0.10) to have higher DM digestibility (64.6%). Ileal starch digestibilities were lower (P < 0.05) for dogs fed HA (64.0%) and AM (63.0%). Ileal digestibilities of essential (71.2%), nonessential (67.4%), and total (69.0%) AA tended to be higher (P < 0.10) for HP diets compared with CONV (66.4, 62.4, and 64.0%, respectively). Total-tract DM, OM, CP, and GE digestibilities (77, 82, 77, and 84%, on average, respectively) were higher (P < 0.05) for dogs fed CONV, HP, and HPLP than for those fed AM (66.9, 71.6, 72.6, and 76.5%) and HA (60.6, 65.7, 69.7, and 71.5%). Total-tract fat digestibilities were lower (P < 0.05) for dogs fed HA diets (86.6%) than for all other treatments (91.0%, on average). Total-tract starch digestibilities were higher (P < 0.05) for dogs fed CONV, HP, and HPLP (98%, on average) compared with HA (72.8%) and AM (76.5%). No differences were detected among treatments in fecal bifidobacteria, lactobacilli, or Clostridium perfringens concentrations. The experiments demonstrated that HP and HPLP corn had hydrolytic digestion and fermentation characteristics similar to those of CONV corn, whereas HA resulted in similar responses to AM, a well-established resistant starch ingredient.

Effect of dietary protein content on behavior in dogs.
J Am Vet Med Assoc 1996 Feb 1;208(3):376-9
Department of Surgery, School of Veterinary Medicine, Tufts University, North Grafton, MA 01536, USA.
OBJECTIVE--To determine the effect that feeding diets containing a low (17%), medium (25%), or high (32%) protein content would have on behavior in dogs. DESIGN--Prospective, controlled study. ANIMALS--12 dogs with dominance aggression, 12 dogs with hyperactivity, 12 dogs with territorial aggression, and 14 control dogs without behavioral problems. PROCEDURE--Dogs were fed each of the diets for a 2-week period, and owners were instructed to score their dogs' behavior on a daily basis. RESULTS--Behavior of the dogs with dominance aggression, dogs with hyperactivity, and control dogs was unchanged by the dietary manipulations. Territorial aggression was significantly reduced when dogs were fed the low- or medium-protein diet, compared with territorial aggression when fed the high-protein diet. Post hoc analysis indicated that this effect was attributable to a marked reduction in aggression in a subset of the group (n = 7) in which territorial aggression was a result of fear. CLINICAL IMPLICATIONS--Results of this study suggest that a reduction in dietary protein content is not generally useful in the treatment of behavior problems in dogs, but may be appropriate in dogs with territorial aggression that is a result of fear.

Weight Loss in Obese Dogs: Evaluation of a High-Protein, Low-Carbohydrate Diet
Marianne Diez3, Patrick Nguyen*, Isabelle Jeusette, Claire Devois , Louis Istasse and Vincent Biourge
Animal Nutrition Unit, Faculty of Veterinary Medicine, University of Liège, Liège, Belgium; * Department of Nutrition, National Veterinary School of Nantes, Nantes, France and Royal Canin, Centre de Recherche, Aimargues, France

Obesity and excess body weight are estimated to affect approximately 25% of dogs receiving veterinary care in Western countries (1,2). They are recognized as the most common nutritional diseases in companion animals (3). Energy restriction both during and after weight loss is the cornerstone to achieve and maintain optimal body condition. An important concern with energy restricted diet, however, is to cover all the requirements for essential nutrients, especially protein. In obese humans and animals, increasing dietary protein during weight loss programs has been shown to maintain lean body mass (4,5). The purpose of this study was therefore to assess the effect of a high-protein low-starch weight-reduction diet in the management of canine obesity.
In a preliminary study of client-owned dogs nine overweight or obese dogs (8 females and 1 male) with mean ages, body weights and body condition scores (BCS) of 8 y (range 3–10), 30 kg (13.5–48) and 4.6/5 (4.5–5 in a 5-point scale), respectively were recruited. Mean excess body weight was 30% (11–58). History and clinical examination revealed inactivity or lethargy (n = 5), impaired breathing (n = 3) and locomotion problems (n = 2) but all other variables were within normal limits.
Treatment consisted of feeding a high-protein, low-starch diet at 40–55% of maintenance energy requirements (MER) for the dog’s estimated optimal body weight until it reached optimum body condition. Dogs were fed twice daily and sessions of exercise of at least 20 min/d were recommended to prevent excess protein catabolism and to minimize losses of fat-free mass (FFM).
The time necessary to reach the target weight and a BCS of 3 ranged from 4 to 38 wk (mean ± SEM: 18.3 ± 3.8). The rate of weight loss varied from 0.8 to 3.1% (1.9 ± 0.3) per wk. Weight loss improved or suppressed the inactivity, lethargy, impaired breathing and locomotion problems initially reported by the owners.

In conclusion, in the experimental study, although rates of weight loss slightly differed between reducing diets, our data suggest that higher protein intake might reduce lean body mass losses. Energy restriction should be higher in female dogs and validated over time to ensure regular weight loss. From our field study, it appears that our test diet allowed safe and efficient weight loss.


Effect of dietary protein content and tryptophan supplementation on dominance aggression, territorial aggression, and hyperactivity in dogs.
DeNapoli JS, Dodman NH, Shuster L, Rand WM, Gross KL.
Department of Clinical Sciences, School of Veterinary Medicine, Tufts University, Grafton, MA 01536, USA.

OBJECTIVE: To evaluate the effect of high- and low-protein diets with or without tryptophan supplementation on behavior of dogs with dominance aggression, territorial aggression, and hyperactivity. DESIGN: Prospective crossover study. ANIMALS: 11 dogs with dominance aggression, 11 dogs with territorial aggression, and 11 dogs with hyperactivity. PROCEDURE: In each group, 4 diets were fed for 1 weeks each in random order with a transition period of not < 3 days between each diet. Two diets had low protein content (approximately 18%), and 2 diets had high protein content (approximately 30%). Two of the diets (1 low-protein and 1 high-protein) were supplemented with tryptophan. Owners scored their dog's behavior daily by use of customized behavioral score sheets. Mean weekly values of 5 behavioral measures and serum concentrations of serotonin and tryptophan were determined at the end of each dietary period. RESULTS: For dominance aggression, behavioral scores were highest in dogs fed unsupplemented high-protein rations. For territorial aggression, [corrected] tryptophan-supplemented low-protein diets were associated with significantly lower behavioral scores than low-protein diets without tryptophan supplements. CONCLUSIONS AND CLINICAL RELEVANCE: For dogs with dominance aggression, the addition of tryptophan to high-protein diets or change to a low-protein diet may reduce aggression. For dogs with territorial aggression, tryptophan supplementation of a low-protein diet may be helpful in reducing aggression
Erratum in:
J Am Vet Med Assoc 2000 Oct 1;217(7):1012.
Comment in:
J Am Vet Med Assoc. 2000 Oct 1;217(7):988-9.
Questions tryptophan dosage and pain tolerance.
Messonnier S.
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  #39  
Old October 4th, 2006, 10:26 AM
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umm, coles notes anyone?
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Their impression of power is remarkable. They give one the feeling of immense reserves of energy, of great reservoirs of knowledge, of tolerance of disposition, obstinacy of purpose, and tenacity of principle. They are responsive, and they have a lot of quiet, good sense.

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Old October 4th, 2006, 12:14 PM
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Sorry If you want to read more of some of them, some were free, but others require a subscription to a society or journal to gain access. Go to www.pubmed.gov and search for these citations, or just search for whatever you are wondering about. I didn't see too much about behavior and high protein diets, except those 2 on the list. And the last one has some comments and a correction, so not sure what was up with that. I wouldn't go quoting it, that's for sure. Pubmed doesn't catalog every article in every journal, so there could be studies out there, I just couldnt' find them. Overall, just scanning thru i'd say high protein diets are good, at least, if the protein sources are high quality. Esp good if your dog needs to lose weight... I didn't see anything saying not to feed dogs a high protein diet. Anyway, my dog seemed jittery on the high protein Evo, could have been from the protein, or anything else in the food (or not from the food at all). I don't know. I do like both the Evo and the Canidae better than the Science Diet lamb and rice he was on, he is digesting his food faster (this is good because he gets carsick) and has smaller stool, although it is somewhat soft. He may just need more time to adjust to a new food.
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  #41  
Old October 4th, 2006, 04:00 PM
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Cider's on a mix of leftover old barking at the moon, innova freeze dried, evo rm, and dvp ultra. So 3 high protein, one not.. and she's got the smallest poops ever, and my active pooper has finally stopped doing 5 poops anytime we are active.

I just hope that higher protein really will be okay long term. Being mill I have no idea of potential medical issues to look for from her background.
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  #42  
Old October 4th, 2006, 05:43 PM
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So is this high protien supposed to be fine for all aged dogs or just adults? This pretty much goese agaisnt everything I've been told regarding large breed puppies.
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Please please please give Maggie the steak! Its not too big for her little mouth!

Their impression of power is remarkable. They give one the feeling of immense reserves of energy, of great reservoirs of knowledge, of tolerance of disposition, obstinacy of purpose, and tenacity of principle. They are responsive, and they have a lot of quiet, good sense.

-J. Wentworth Day, from The Dog in Sport, 1938
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  #43  
Old October 4th, 2006, 07:47 PM
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I don't think personally I'd feed high protein kibble to any large or extra large breed puppy. Could get your dog to grow faster than is healthy, potentially leading to complications or problems like pano.

Once grown though I don't see the problem.
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  #44  
Old October 4th, 2006, 07:50 PM
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so then... a raw diet is NOT high in protein, right? it promotes slow and steady growth for puppies, optimal for large & giant breeds... no pano, no growth spurts, no porous bones... ?
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Old October 4th, 2006, 07:55 PM
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I don't see raw issues hun. Never heard of people having problems. Only heard of pups growing too fast on 'normal' doggie food diets that were on the higher end of the protein scale, like 26-28 instead of 22-24.

Think Greaterdane had a pup a while back that had weirdly splayed feet.. Was growing too fast on a higher protein diet, but not high high protein. Needed like 22% to get that pup to be normal and fix his feet.
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  #46  
Old October 4th, 2006, 07:57 PM
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Even the girly on the dogfood project doesn't think high protein kibbles are good for large breed puppies...
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Old October 4th, 2006, 07:59 PM
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awe poor puppy... did the feet issue correct itself, do you know?...

i'm just confused now, some people on this forum say raw diets are not high in protein, others say they are. it's like the more i know, the less i know! oh well... i won't analyse it and just keep doin' what i'm doin'... (but i'd still like to know, LOL!)

did i just threadjack??!!
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Old October 4th, 2006, 08:00 PM
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Personally, I don't think that raw is as high as 42% by weight, no matter how you do the math about it.
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Old October 4th, 2006, 08:03 PM
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Yeah, slowed growth fixed his feet. After seeing that though, it makes me really want to warn people about dog's growing too too fast, you know?

I know Techno.. everyone says raw is super high in protein, but somehow or another it isn't the same or equal I don't think.. Not that I know enough BARF feeders, or BARF feeders that fed it to pups to know who had issues how.. I've only heard about the kibble folk feeding slightly higher protein than average and their tons of issues. Not everyone by any means, but enough people that it makes you really wonder. And then I wonder now that there is a variety of grain free diets even higher in protein available now, What that might do to a puppy's growth..
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Old October 4th, 2006, 09:22 PM
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what do you guys think of this article?...

http://www.b-naturals.com/Jan2004.php
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  #51  
Old October 4th, 2006, 09:29 PM
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From the purina one:
Quote:
"This study, conducted in young Great Danes during their first half-year of life, concluded that dietary protein increased to 32 percent does not negatively affect skeletal or cartilage development in these dogs. The research also confirmed that dietary protein did not have detrimental effects on liver and kidney functioning."
First 6 months isn't enough. How about rechecking when they're 5 and seeing how close to arthritis they have become? That's when it counts. At 6 months, they're not even 1/3 grown yet.

And the Euk one right below it states the same study over again. Hmm... the next .edu one too...

Quote:
Therefore we now advise to raise dogs, vulnerable for these skeletal diseases, on a balanced food with a calcium content decreased to 0.8 or 0.9% on dmb (dry matter basis)."
This is must-know knowledge for any large breed puppy raiser. Calcium is definitely the most important factor, IMO, in regulating bone growth.
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Old October 5th, 2006, 04:34 AM
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Exactly Prin. My pup just turned 6 months on Sat. He was 70lbs. He probably has to put on another 50-60lbs and wont mature fully for a few years. So the affects of this diet may not be visable until hes much older and larger.

As for the raw protien levels, I've always been told its closer to 21-23%.
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Please please please give Maggie the steak! Its not too big for her little mouth!

Their impression of power is remarkable. They give one the feeling of immense reserves of energy, of great reservoirs of knowledge, of tolerance of disposition, obstinacy of purpose, and tenacity of principle. They are responsive, and they have a lot of quiet, good sense.

-J. Wentworth Day, from The Dog in Sport, 1938
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Old October 5th, 2006, 08:23 AM
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how about a photo of that big beautiful boy of yours?
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  #54  
Old October 5th, 2006, 09:00 AM
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SuperWanda SuperWanda is offline
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I thought there was a long discussion in a previous post about raw protein compared to dry??? Percent protein vs absolute and the like. I thought that the conclusion was that the 40% is probably close to raw %??? I don't know, I was confused at the time and am still confused

I'm still a little cautious with this high protein kibble. I had to take my one dog to the vet the other day because she was whining when she was trying to go to the bathroom. She is the one with the anal gland issues. Although she has always had problems she has never had them to this degree. The vet expressed her glands. Very painful for her and I am to continue to apply warm compresses to the area for a couple of days. Bring her back tomorrow if she is still sore - but she thought it was likely the full glands which have irritated the surrounding tissue. No infection thankfully!

Although my vet supports higher protein foods - the lack of fibre may be contributing to her glands filling up??? She said that although the poops may be firm, they may not be bulky enough for her to empty the glands. Her glands are also set back a little further than they would be normally.

I feel so bad for her - she is so sad :sad: I am considering going back to a food with more grains.

If anyone has any suggestions for a food that is good for dogs with anal gland troubles please let me know. Allergies, anal glands. This is getting complicated!!!

Last edited by SuperWanda; October 5th, 2006 at 09:04 AM.
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  #55  
Old October 5th, 2006, 09:08 AM
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technodoll technodoll is offline
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why don't you just feed the grainless kibble but add some healthy, natural fibre? such as canned green beans (drained & rinsed) chopped into bits, or babyfood veggies (peas, beans, etc) as a treat, or sprinkle some Benefibre on the kibble, etc?
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  #56  
Old October 5th, 2006, 09:31 AM
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SuperWanda SuperWanda is offline
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Thanks Techno - I was just reading about some good additions like pitted prunes, pumpkin or a couple of tsp. of oat bran.

What is benefiber??? I'll have to look that one up. Ok I just did - it is guar gum. Now what is that??? - it is from the guar bean.

I have heard that fibersmart capsules are good - for people that is. I think those contain flax and borage seed fibre. But I guess some people say too much flax can make some dogs itch.

I guess there are many varieties of fibre!!!
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  #57  
Old October 5th, 2006, 11:12 AM
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SuperWanda SuperWanda is offline
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So - I know that adding things like veggies will add more fiber but will it make the stool too soft?

I guess what I'm aiming for is a bulky yet firm stool. Would that be optimum for clearing the anal glands??? And what foods would therefore achieve this result???

I never thought in my life that I would be calculating the optimum consistency of poo!
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  #58  
Old October 5th, 2006, 12:01 PM
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Scott_B Scott_B is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by technodoll
how about a photo of that big beautiful boy of yours?



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Please please please give Maggie the steak! Its not too big for her little mouth!

Their impression of power is remarkable. They give one the feeling of immense reserves of energy, of great reservoirs of knowledge, of tolerance of disposition, obstinacy of purpose, and tenacity of principle. They are responsive, and they have a lot of quiet, good sense.

-J. Wentworth Day, from The Dog in Sport, 1938
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  #59  
Old October 5th, 2006, 05:24 PM
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meb999 meb999 is offline
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your boy is really filling out well!! I remember the first pics you posted of him, he was so much smaller. What a handsome big boy he's becoming. I love mastiffs....and boxers, and great danes, and labs, heck I love all dogs!!
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  #60  
Old October 6th, 2006, 12:29 AM
Prin Prin is offline
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Lookin' good!

Just another comment to add... Jemma is still drooling on this food. It's like the food unblocked the saliva ducts and just let it all flow. And on the downside, she's always hungry now... She just stares at me with this intensity for long periods of time and I definitely know what she's thinking...
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