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Old December 9th, 2009, 12:58 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Need help with this big decision!

Hi Everyone.
I'm new to this forum, and I need experienced animal lovers to help me make a very big decision.

I am looking for either a cat or a small dog for my family. Here's some information on us;


We live in a townhouse, with only a small fenced area in the front. There is a common area beyond that with grass and trees and plants, but it is not fenced.

The house inside is fairly large, with 3 floors. Lots of room for a small animal to explore and run around. The main floor is hardwood and only the upstairs bedrooms have carpet. I am not *too* worried about shedding, as I do have a very good vaccuum.

There is me, my husband and our 2 year old daughter. She is very good with animals. She likes them but has been taught to more or less not touch them. She will tentatively pet a dog or cat, if I am with her, but she is wary because she has been scratched by my best friends cat a few times (he doesn't like small children and has scratched her unprovoked twice).

I am very experienced with animal training, as I grew up on a farm training horses, cattle dogs, and we had cats (barn as well as house). My husband is a little clueless, but I can teach him. I am very confident in my ability to train a dog properly, so I am not worried about behaviour issues. Anyways once i make my decision the pet will be ours for life, period. I don't believe in giving up animals due to behaviour problems, that are more often than not the result of poor ownership.

OK, so that's our background. Here are my options.

My husband would prefer a dog. If we are going to get a dog, I need some advice on a breed. I am not familiar with small dogs at all, and I have no idea which ones, if any, can thrive with only a small yard and daily walks. I would like to have a dog that I can take jogging with me in the warmer months, but am concerned about having a dog inside in winter.

My father lives on a farm, and is constantly getting cats that people take out and abandon. He has one particular cat that is very special. You know those one in a million type cats that act kind of like a dog. He comes when you call him, will follow you around and is always wanting to curl up in your lap. He is great with kids, my daughter doesn't attempt it but her cousins have been known to carry him around like a rag doll, while he hangs in their arms purring at them. This cat LOVES children! It's rather remarkable. The only issue, is that my stepmother has become attached, and may not want to let him go. I am also unsure of how he will take to being inside most of the time, as he is used to his freedom on the farm. My father is concerned that he will get eaten by the coyotes (as usually happens with the cats) and he is also worried that there are getting to be too many cats on the farm, so he would be happy to give this kitty a new home.

If you've read this far, thanks so much! Any constructive comments are much appreciated!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 01:14 PM
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Where are you located? I have a dog named Benson, does well with polite children, not good with other dogs. He's an orange peke with a not too pushed in face. He would rather cuddle than walk, but he'll gladly go for a jog if you want him to. He's fairly good on leash, and he is crate trained.

The only issue is he needs to be neutered. He's two years old.

The dog came to me as a rescue, he was skin and bones, half bald and parasite FULL. He's in perfect health now, but he can't stay here any longer as he really, really does not get along with my dogs. :O(
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Old December 9th, 2009, 01:39 PM
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I guess the best question to ask you is about your lifestyle. Are you dedicated to walk the dog 3 times a day? Are you active with your family where a dog can accompany you? As you know dogs are like children and are higher maintenance than a cat.

Cats on the other hand are less intrusive when it comes to your routine. No walks required, just daily cleaning of the kitty litter, lots of great food, toys, a scratching post and grooming.

I have both types of animals and though I am a huge dog lover, I equally find great joy and love for my cats. To me they are equal. However, with the dogs I must maintain a certain routine and they are more high maintenance.

Just food for thought and perhaps a great family discussion and compromise.

Good luck.

(shhhh - I say go for that special dog-cat...(Ok who said that))!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 01:41 PM
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Wow, why don't you get a dog and a cat . That way your daughter can experience both .

I really don't know anything about dogs, but do know a titch or two about cats.

I would not advise on a small kitten, as they can be so rambunctious and are still learning their "social skills" and so may accidentally bite or scratch a little too hard. When adopting a small kitten, I would always recommend two, it is so much easier on the humans and I didn't get the impression you wanted two cats. A cat who is older (over 9 months) has their personalilty pretty much formed. Getting a cat from a rescue or smaller shelter may allow you to learn more about the personality of the cat before adopting, especially if it has been in a foster home. If you do decide on a kitten, try to find one that has been with it's momma and/or litter mates for at least 10 weeks. This will help ensure the kitten has had more time learning to be gentle in play.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:21 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Thanks for all the advice so far.

BabySweet, we are located in Calgary, so too far to adopt your doggy.

Ideally, I want a dog over a cat, but knowing what a HUGE responsibility it is, am leaning toward the kitty. I wouldn't want to adopt a kitten, they are just too crazy to deal with when I have a 2 year old daughter around. I am waiting to hear from my dad if my stepmom can part with Tuxie (the dog-cat). If she sais yes, then I think we will take him. He will be almost as big a responsibility because she will want to make sure that he is getting the best care possible.

But, oh...how I want a dog! I've been looking into the different breeds of small dogs, as I have very little experience with them. I have been looking particularly into Min Pins, but I can't find any reliable information on wether they are good in a small townhome with a small yard or not. I definitly do not want a ****zu or anything like that, my husband does not like those dogs much at all.

Anyways, thanks for the advice so far... I'll keep checking back here for some more advice, and eventually I can update with the outcome.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:25 PM
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BenMax;
In regards to our lifestyle, we are very active in the summer. The pup would have lots of opportunity to play outdoors with the family. We go biking and hiking often in the mountains, which is only an hours drive from here (lucky us!).

I am however, concerened about winter, as we don't go out much when it's so cold. That's another reason I was considering a min pin, as they don't do well in the cold either. The dog would also have ample opportunity to visit the farm where my dad lives, and socialize with the farm dogs there., run wild in the fields, etc.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:26 PM
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There is a member named Bailey from the Calgary area that may be able to help you. I think luvmypitgrls is from High River area, she may also be able to help you.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:28 PM
BenMax BenMax is offline
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I have a min pin and I do not recommend this breed with small children. They are cute but they are extremely active, hard to train, have an attitude, very delicate and can literally break their legs and back easily (ask Brenda and the gang about this one).

If you ever decide on a small breed, google for rescue groups within your area or surrounding area. Most dogs that are in rescues are in foster homes and they will be in the best position to tell you about a dog you maybe interested in. This way you will know if the dog is house trained, good with dogs, cats and kids etc... It is a foolproof way to adopt.

Just read your above - not good dogs for the farm either. They are not ideal dogs for a family that has small children and they will run on open ground as they are ratters. They are difficult to get back once on a mission. And if you are worried about coyotes - they will make wonderful little snacks for them as well.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:34 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Thanks BenMax, that's exactly the type of information I was looking for!
I fell in love with the way the Min Pin looks, but really had zero knowledge of the breed characteristics. Looks like I can rule that one out now.

Perhaps I'll start to get more involved in the rescue groups around here. I have the time and eventually the perfect dog just might pop up. I would not mind having a mature dog in the least.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Looking4u View Post
Thanks BenMax, that's exactly the type of information I was looking for!
I fell in love with the way the Min Pin looks, but really had zero knowledge of the breed characteristics. Looks like I can rule that one out now.

Perhaps I'll start to get more involved in the rescue groups around here. I have the time and eventually the perfect dog just might pop up. I would not mind having a mature dog in the least.
My pleasure. Knowledge is power afterall.

Indeed rescue groups are your answer. Shelter dogs also come with a history from previous owners. There are many wonderfully stable great dogs waiting for a second chance. Getting a mature dog is a perfect solution as long as the dog is child savvy.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 03:43 PM
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I know you said you don't want a Shih Tzu... but they are great little dogs. Active, but not too active. Good with kids. Are not easily breakable (such as the person posted above regarding min pin).

If you keep their coats short (puppy cut is the cutest) then grooming ins't much of an issue.

Most dogs in the herding group are also good with young children. I grew up with Old English Sheep dogs (known as "the nanny"). They seem to do a very good job at keeping an eye on children. I remember more then once being knocked on my butt if I got too close to the road while playing in the front yard.

All the bitches we ever had would do a walkabout throughout the night just to make sure everyone was in their beds and sleeping well. If we were sick she would stick by that person's bed and if one of us was away from the pack she would sleep just outside that person's room.

The Dogs In Canada website is a good place to look around at different breeds. It gives a short description of activity levels, grooming needs eta. It will also have links (if I remember correctly) to rescue groups by prov.

You may find this helpful in the beginning stages of looking.

But don't forget those cute mixed breeds at your local shelter. They need homes too and can be just as great if not better companion for your family. And most shelters will be able to help you pick the right dog for your life style and the age of children living in your home.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 03:52 PM
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Just saw this post.

Looking4U, please check out these rescue groups. Maybe some of these dogs (or cats) catch your eye? I can personally vouch for all of these rescues, wonderful adoption coordinators who are all very dedicated to helping you find a great match!!

http://www.albertaanimalrescuecrew.com/

http://www.pawsitivematch.org/

http://www.mistycreekdogrescue.com/
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:13 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Thanks everyone! Looks like I came to the right place.
My husband and I are taking my daughter to a few shelters tonight to see if they have anything that catches our eye. I went through quite a few websites with the animals pictures and stories, but I just can't decide based on a picture- they all look great.

Elizabeth Anne;
I wish I had a bigger yard, so I could get a herding dog. I grew up with Border Collies and they are absolutly fabulous but I know I don't have the space they need to thrive. An English sheep dog would be ideal, if only we had a bigger yard.

One day, when we upgrade to a bigger house with a yard, I will make my husband find me a great big dog like that as a housewarming gift!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:16 PM
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Macomom Macomom is offline
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Hi Looking4U,
I am a large breed dog lover, always on the look out for a Great Dane- so with that being said- I currently have a basset hound here with me as a foster. I have had her a short while, but from what I have experienced and been told- this is a great breed for a starting family.
My dog here is calm, gentle and slow. She likes to walk, take it up a notch to a gallop, but intense running would be out of the question. She likes to nap and sleep and doesn't take up much space. I have heard they can be difficult to housetrain and stubborn, but her gentle disposition and natural love for children makes up for it.
She is a medium sized dog who would work well in the city.
Just a thought!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:17 PM
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Just to clarify, as a large breed dog lover, I never thought I would recommed a smallish dog I always thought there was not enough to love- mistaken!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:32 PM
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Before any decisions are made have you considered the following -

What will you do in the future if one of your children (or your child if she is going to be a one and only) develops allergies? That is the number one reason (excuse) people get rid of their pets.
Time commitment - do you have the time and energy to put into the making of a happy, healthy pet. Dogs like their exercise. Cats like theirs too with interactive toys. Both love tons of cuddling (hopefully)
Are you prepared to deal with a dog that may suffer from separation anxiety? That can lead to very destructive habits. Chewing shoes,woodwork, etc., barking, whining. Or a dog who has allergies to certain foods or fleas? It can sometimes take a long time to find a food that works for them.
If you live in a townhouse are there rules about pets and scooping? Can you add on an enclosure so if you decide on a cat kitty can be outside safely?
How clean do you like your home? It is inevitable with any pet that they will shed. Or, if you decide on a dog, it will sometimes be wet and dirty from playing outside. Lots of mopping cleaning up dirty footprints.

Here's a couple of sites that may help a little...

http://aplaceofourown.org/question_detail.php?id=659

http://www.helium.com/knowledge/4534...dren-have-pets

After doing some research you may find the best decision you can make at this time is to wait for your child to be a little older. Until then let her visit the pets at your dad's farm. Maybe get her involved in looking after them. Walking a small dog. Helping to change litter, etc.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:33 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Hi Macomom-
It may have been a great possibility, but I see you are in Ontario, we are located in Calgary.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 04:41 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 14+kitties View Post
Before any decisions are made have you considered the following -

What will you do in the future if one of your children (or your child if she is going to be a one and only) develops allergies? That is the number one reason (excuse) people get rid of their pets.
Time commitment - do you have the time and energy to put into the making of a happy, healthy pet. Dogs like their exercise. Cats like theirs too with interactive toys. Both love tons of cuddling (hopefully)
Are you prepared to deal with a dog that may suffer from separation anxiety? That can lead to very destructive habits. Chewing shoes,woodwork, etc., barking, whining. Or a dog who has allergies to certain foods or fleas? It can sometimes take a long time to find a food that works for them.
If you live in a townhouse are there rules about pets and scooping? Can you add on an enclosure so if you decide on a cat kitty can be outside safely?
How clean do you like your home? It is inevitable with any pet that they will shed. Or, if you decide on a dog, it will sometimes be wet and dirty from playing outside. Lots of mopping cleaning up dirty footprints.

Here's a couple of sites that may help a little...

http://aplaceofourown.org/question_detail.php?id=659

http://www.helium.com/knowledge/4534...dren-have-pets

After doing some research you may find the best decision you can make at this time is to wait for your child to be a little older. Until then let her visit the pets at your dad's farm. Maybe get her involved in looking after them. Walking a small dog. Helping to change litter, etc.
Yes, I've thought all these over.
Like I said, I firmly beleive that once you have a pet, it's yours for life. My dad gets so many abandoned animals it's heartbreaking. Being raised on a farm, I was taught proper respect for animals, and the responsibilty you owe them when they are yours.

My daughter has no allergies to cats, she has been around plenty. Myself and my husband have never shown any allergies to anything, but in any case we would want to get to know the shelter animal and handle it before we dedicate ourselves to it to be sure. That's a great point you brought up. If we do get the ok to take Tuxie, my dads rescue'd kitty, we have been around him lots, and are not allergic.

Oh- the cleanups, I am aware of! Thankfully most of my house is hardwoods, and easy to clean. I also have a Dyson so that will help.

I have been thinking about getting a pet for quite a few years. I've had to restrain myself for so long knowing that it was not the proper time to get a pet. However, now I find we are in a good financial position, and I do have the time to dedicate to a pet.

Thanks for the points, there are certainly many people who have no idea what they are getting into when they get a pet (seen this first hand with all the drop-offs) but I do beleive I am ready for this commitment!
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Old December 9th, 2009, 05:20 PM
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I know everyone wants a small bred, non shedding, hypo allergic dog. I know with my rescue, I Do not adopt out to people with kids under 12. Sorry, but dogs are not toys and having a toddler with a small dog is a bad mix. You cannot possibly say at 2 years old, your child is kind. They want to hug and tug (not in a mean way) and perhaps your child could get hurt. The only black eye I ever got was given to me by a toddler. LOL I would recommend a lab or a golden retreiver. Something a little sturdier. Now a cat would be purrrrfect as they can jump and hide, if they are too loved.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by 14+kitties View Post

What will you do in the future if one of your children (or your child if she is going to be a one and only) develops allergies? That is the number one reason (excuse) people get rid of their pets.
Sorry for hijacking, but there is empirical research suggesting that children exposure to animals in first year of life reduces the risk of developing allergies, when measured 7 years later. Also, simple hand hygiene can reduce risk of allergic reactions by 95%.

I am aware that this is just fluff for those looking for excuses, but I hope it might provide a different perspective for new owners

Didn't see someone mention the Portuguese water dogs, they're medium size, but most of them would make a good family dog.

Cos
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Old December 9th, 2009, 05:49 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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A toddler is only as bad as the parent will allow.
That argument could go on forever so I'll end it with that, but as I've stated many times we certainly do not have the yard space for a lab or a retreiver.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 05:53 PM
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I think spending a little time volunteering with shelters or rescues is a great idea . There's always an exception to the rule when it comes to breed characteristics...who knows who you'll all end up falling in love with .
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Old December 9th, 2009, 06:10 PM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Thanks for the links Bailey!
After perusing through I am contemplating rescuing a Basset Hound.
But, I think it's a good idea to volunteer at a shelter and see what comes up.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cos View Post
Sorry for hijacking, but there is empirical research suggesting that children exposure to animals in first year of life reduces the risk of developing allergies, when measured 7 years later. Also, simple hand hygiene can reduce risk of allergic reactions by 95%.

I am aware that this is just fluff for those looking for excuses, but I hope it might provide a different perspective for new owners

Didn't see someone mention the Portuguese water dogs, they're medium size, but most of them would make a good family dog.

Cos
I will also apologize for threadjacking. Although really it isn't. The more info the better IMO.

Research, smesearch. It doesn't matter how much research has been done. Fact is that allergies are the number one reason cats in particular are given up or abandoned. We as responsible pet owners may know how to reduce or avoid allergies. However irresponsible owners jump on the allergy bandwagon quickly when they no longer want to be bothered by a cat. As someone who has a few cats I bet a few of them came by the way of allergies. Most of mine who weren't born here to ferals have been dumped cats.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 07:48 PM
t.pettet t.pettet is offline
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Need help

If you are concerned about having a dog inside in winter then perhaps you should get an inside cat as no dog should live outside 24/7 they need to be with their family.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 07:59 PM
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If you are not ready to commit to min. 2 walks a day, a dog is not for you. Sorry to be blunt here. I see that the reason you want a small dog is you have a small fenced yard. That's no substitution for the daily walk even for a small breed.
We have a big dog and a good size yard. The dog will use the yard to do his business in between his walks. Other than that, he will not exercise in the yard on his own. May be it's just ours. He will not play unless he gets somebody (either 2 or 4 legged) to play with.
On the other hand, a cat is more self sufficient. They probably do fine living inside if they are brought up as inside cat. I don't know if a adult farm cat your father adopted can readjust to live inside. I am not a cat person but I grew up having cats in the house. I know for a fact they are less predictable. I was bitten by our cat, when I was a kid, in the ear for no reason. That you may have to consider for your young daughter.
I would recommend a lab to any family (strongly biased). Don't let their size scares you, my 95# dog will gently dance around some 7-pounder without hurting the little guy. OK, the truth is he only stepped on his toe once by accident. Kidding aside, I know a couple of labs are small statued aroung 65#. Something you may want to look into.
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Old December 9th, 2009, 08:04 PM
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Quote:
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If you are concerned about having a dog inside in winter then perhaps you should get an inside cat as no dog should live outside 24/7 they need to be with their family.
I'm pretty sure that's not what she meant .
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Old December 9th, 2009, 11:28 PM
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Looking4U, let me know if you would like specific contact information for those rescue links I sent you to talk to an adoption coordinator or volunteer.

Also, you know best what size/breed dog will suit your family. I have to also disagree with the thought that a large breed dog is going to be better for your toddler. I have an 18 month old daughter and we have dogs of all sizes and breeds in our home. I can say without a doubt that our smallest dog, a foster named Gizmo - he's a small breed mix - is the best with our daughter. (And he's a whopping eight pounds!)

Our labs are quite exhuberant and bouncy and often times we've had to intervene on a possible collision course when the lab girls get really excited and playful. Our daughter is simply 'bowling over' height. She walks (now runs ) great now, but when she was first learning it was a very tense situation; constantly making sure that the dogs didn't rub up against her and throw her off balance.

Whatever size dog you bring home, just make sure that your child and dog meet long before the 'bring home day'. This is imperative to see how they react to one another.

You mentioned Basset Hound - I thought I'd give you some direct links to dogs available in Calgary right now for adoption that might be a suitable temperment/appearance/size for what you seem to be interested in. None are Bassets, but all need homes.

http://www.petfinder.com/petnote/dis...petid=15065478
That girl is with Pawsitive Match.

http://mistycreekmilo.blogspot.com/

http://sharai-firstnight.blogspot.co...zza-night.html
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Last edited by Bailey_; December 9th, 2009 at 11:35 PM.
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  #29  
Old December 10th, 2009, 10:33 AM
Looking4u Looking4u is offline
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Thanks again Bailey!!

Peaches had actually caught my eye when I was looking through the sites. I think I may look more into her.

TKW; no need to apologise for being blunt. I realise the commitment, especially the daily walks, but I was concerned that may not be enough. Most people I know that have dogs also have a large yard for them to run free in. Definitly not a substitution for walks. Also, many shelters state on their page they will not adopt to you unless you have a sufficient yard or dog run.

t.pettet;
Um no, that's definitly not what I meant. I know there are certain breeds that don't do well in the freezing cold at ALL (Min Pins, from what I've researched) and was looking for some insight into which breeds to avoid due to this. I would never leave my dog outside 24/7!!
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  #30  
Old December 10th, 2009, 10:57 AM
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Macomom Macomom is offline
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Good Luck.
It has been part of my parenting beliefs that my children are raised with animals in our house. It has been a great teaching point for compassion, respect and thinking of others. As they get older, we are teaching them responsibilty- closing doors, not letting the dogs in certain spaces etc..
Since we have been fostering, it is also about community involvement and accountability- who will take care of these dogs if we don't help them out?
It has been a wonderful lesson for everyone involved.
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