"Rash" or bites on belly...

[bendyfoot]

Hi all,
anyone ever seen this? Jaida (6 month old GSD) developed a strange rash a couple of days ago. It started off looking like simple chaffing...it's basically on her little belly and in the "crotch" area on her thighs...she has a funny gait because of her leg deformity, and we figured it was sweat combined with her no-fur pink puppy skin there getting rubbed.
Then, yesterday, there were very distinctive oval/circular patches, that looked almost like a "bulls-eye"...there seemed to be a tiny poke mark in the middle, which then had a pale area around it, and the pale area was encircled with a dark red ring. I've never seen anything like this. Could it be a reaction to fleas or another insect? Strange thing: this morning, it's back to looking like only a slightly pink general irritation...no bullseyes anywhere...
weird.

[Skryker]

This is on a person, but did it look like this?


This is ringworm. It's easily treated with an ointment from the vet, but it's also highly contagious and spreads to people.


Can't find a good image, but eczema can cause weird round patches, too-extremely dry skin that can also be caused by contact with an irritant or allergen.

[bendyfoot]

Hmmm...did look kind of like that, actually, with the bold ring. There's no scalyness or dryness there though. The marks are not there today, but now I'm grossed out. I know that ringworm is a tough one to lick sometimes, and we have four other animals in the house I'll talk to the vet today...

[jessi76]

my dog gets bites on his underbelly that produce a bright ring - and it's from May Flies. they are there the day he gets bit, gone the next. he always gets them on his belly and inside his legs (crotch area). they never last more than a day, never produce a "rash" and he generally doesn't bother w/ them.

[bendyfoot]

Jessi, can you tell me what these May Flies look like? The only Mayflies I'm familiar with are benign, big-winged, large, soft-bodied flies that don't bite (to my knowledge). Are they like little black flies? I'm located in Eastern Ontario, if that helps...

[H.P.]

Ring worm was the first thing that came to my mind too from the description. It is actually a fungus (like athletes foot) not a worm, and if the area gets sweaty during the day, it could make it appear worse as the day goes on. I would call the vet.

[hazelrunpack]

Originally Posted by bendyfoot

Jessi, can you tell me what these May Flies look like? The only Mayflies I'm familiar with are benign, big-winged, large, soft-bodied flies that don't bite (to my knowledge). Are they like little black flies? I'm located in Eastern Ontario, if that helps...

Yes...little black flies. Around here, we call them the Dreaded Black Fly...also known as blood-sucking gnats or just *^#%@$@! The bites you describe sound like the bites they leave. They hang out in the grass and seem to be most active on humid days, especially if it's going to rain.

Our dogs get all bit up this time of year, too. It makes them pretty itchy for a few hours, and they don't want to stay out long when the DBFs are around, but as far as I know, the flies don't transmit any diseases...

[jessi76]

yes the evil blood sucking gnats! they are tiny, relentless, and can leave huge welts after a bite. well, on ME it turns into a welt, on my dog it turns into an oval or circle shaped bite w/ a very red ring and a tiny pinpick in the center. they're harmless really - although around my area the farmers hood the horses as to keep these gnats (may flies; black flies) out of their eyes.

generally when I notice such things, and the dog is not in distress over it, I give it 24-48 hours. if the bite appears to worsen or not fade at all, then it's time for the vet. but so far, each time, the bite has faded on it's own in less than 24 hrs. it's particularly problematic on my poor dog since his entire underside is basically bald. the poor dear gets quite a few bites just going out for a quick play in the yard.

soon these pesky bugs will be replaced w/ mosquitos... ugh. it's never ending.

[hazelrunpack]

Originally Posted by jessi76

soon these pesky bugs will be replaced w/ mosquitos... ugh. it's never ending.

he he I can send ya some ticks to go with those gnats and mosquitoes! (hazel is evil)

[jessi76]

depends on what kind of tick you got.... ... we have mainly deer ticks here. yes, high incidence of lyme here - which is why Tucker will be getting his lyme vac again this year on Thursday. poor fella, but hey, it's gotta be done. the deer ticks are so darn small though! hard to get off! which is why we got a short haired, bald underbelly, type dog. I couldn't even imagine wading through tons of hair and fur for those little buggers each night!

[hazelrunpack]

Originally Posted by jessi76

depends on what kind of tick you got.... ... we have mainly deer ticks here. yes, high incidence of lyme here - which is why Tucker will be getting his lyme vac again this year on Thursday. poor fella, but hey, it's gotta be done. the deer ticks are so darn small though! hard to get off! which is why we got a short haired, bald underbelly, type dog. I couldn't even imagine wading through tons of hair and fur for those little buggers each night!

We have both deer and wood tick. Yesterday I found a nypmh!!!! The size of a pepper flake only if you looked closely you could see it crawling

Getting a bit

[bendyfoot]

I'm guessing that they were fly bites. Her tummy looks ok today still... just a few little pinkish areas, no nasty red spots or rings. And if the flies like to hang out in the grass, that would make sense, because she spent all weekend lying around the lawn and there were TONS of tiny little flies everywhere...I actually remember picking a few out of her fur thinking they might be fleas (they weren't). She hasn't been out much the past few days (too much rain) and she seems fine. I was at the vets picking up heartworm meds this morning and described it to her vet...he suggested red ant bites.
At least it's not ticks, and I'm about 90% sure it's not ringworm...

[Skryker]

That's good news! Ringworm is a nasty thought.

The fly bites sound pretty close to what you're describing, though. that that's all they are.

[hazelrunpack]

Yeah, ringworm can be the very devil to treat! Glad to hear that that's about ruled out! When you pulled those little flies out of her fur, were any of them blood-filled? The black flies actually engorge with blood--their abdomens stretch enough to become translucent--if they've flown from the dog to the window, you can see the blood in their bellies against the light. If you scrape a fed fly out of fur, they often burst...

[bendyfoot]

Nope, I didn't notice any engorged flies. And, none of the people hanging outside all day got bit by anything other than mosquitoes. Maybe it was ants? I'm sure they were bites of some kind...I could see a tiny "pin prick" right in the centre of each ring. Very weird.

[wookiebits]

OMG,

I found the same thing on my Boston Terrier, red areas, that had an almost pin prick in the centre yesterday. I applied the antibiotic ointment, it seems to have dulled the rash down a bit. Here's a pic, I had trouble posting it here, it's on my blog.


http://bp2.blogger.com/_eRDZDBu5Iu8/...+dunno+017.JPG

I do have an influx of black ants in the house, so I wondered if that could be the problem. The other dogs have not been bothered, I think mainly because they have more hair on their bellies.

I will have to wait until next week to get the dog to the vet due to van trouble.

He is not itching or scratching or otherwise uncomfortable, if he was, we would know, as he is a sucky little man.

[bendyfoot]

THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT THEY LOOKED LIKE!!!!!!

Yay, I didn't even think about taking a picture until they were gone... That's so totally it (like, totally ).

Jaida seems fine now, but if you do go to the vet about it, and get an answer about the cause, I would be really interested to find out what they were...
Jaida has a hairless little puppy belly too, while the other animals are fully furred and didn't have any troubles...
what's attacking our neckid-bellied babies???

[bendyfoot]

I just fowarded that link to my vet...if I hear anything back from him, I'll let you know asap. So happy you took pictures!!!

[wookiebits]

Thanks for forwarding it on to your vet, I am stuck in rural land right now. I would love to know of any info that you find out.

I have just washed all the bedding (again), and gave them all a spray of neem oil. Just a few squirts, it is a natural insect repellent. Tully (The Boston) seems much better today, the spots are almost gone.

So glad to hear your pups doing well too!

[bendyfoot]

We live in a rural/agricultural area too... I'm sure our furkids were bit by the same nasty...I hope I hear something from our vet, I know he's in the office today, and he's usually pretty prompt about responding to emails. It'll be tomorrow at the latest...

[bendyfoot]

Well, I got a reply back, but there's not much to say :sad:

And I quote:

"They look like some sort of insect bite but unfortunately I am not sure
which one. Red ants, black flies,fleas come to mind. See if you see
any in the areas that she lies down in or plays"

That might be tricky. She lies down and plays everywhere on our 1acre property. I think the bugs are going to remain a mystery.

Anyone else out there ever seen these bite marks???

p.s. I'm posting the pic around, hoping someone will recognize them...I hope this is oK???

[wookiebits]

Hmmm, well, it's not fleas, because the dogs are treated with Revolution. . .have been for over a month (I started early this season). And there is no flea evidence. (I guess they could be bitten outside, but it seems unlikely, especially because it has been rainy lately).

At least the vet did not say roundworm. That would have been horrible! I would bet on black flies or ants.

I am going to keep giving a small spray of the neem oil on their fur to keep away ants and black flies just in case.

Thanks for the update, it put my mind to rest.

Lisa

[wookiebits]

Ooops, feel free to use the pic. . . maybe someone will recognize the bites right away, and we can put an end to the mystery!

[bendyfoot]

Glad it's not fleas, that was our fear too...we won't be starting with flea/heartworm treatments until June....
I'll let you know if anyone else has some ideas.

[bendyfoot]

I got some replies from another forum, and someone else whose dog has suffered from the same kind of bite marks said that ants were the culprits.

This does make sense...there are lots of little red ants in our gardens when I pull up rocks, and I've seen nests on the lawn before too. Jaida spent all day hanging out in either the lawn or the garden.

I'm going to set up some sugar/baking soda traps for the little buggers and hope that the populations go down a bit...

poor little pink puppy belly...