Speaking up

[Shamrock]

Do you try to educate strangers in public when you see/hear something with their animals that you dont agree with?

In the past, I've generally just let it go. These people didnt "ask" my opinion. Would they listen or believe a stranger? I've always felt they more than likely would discount it, even resent it.
A confrontation might even follow . Who asked you? (MYOB)

A couple of examples that come to mind:
-An intact male dog, humping mine, the owner apologizing and explaining she was waiting till he was 2yrs - so he would be have a better and bolder personality. (what?)
-A man in my neighbouhood approaching me to ask about the "status" of my small male (neutered) as his little female of completely undeterminable origin was looking for "a boyfriend". (WHY?)
-A woman who was shouting at her larger dog in frustration, pushing and pulling on it, yelling rapdifire commands -the poor thing was clearly distressed and didnt know what the heck to do.(considered professional training?)

People dont want unsolicited advice from a total stranger, I've always thought, so in ever case -though all of these made me mad/sad.. I just let them go.

We all see or hear things out there we believe are wrong
With issues of animal cruelty or neglect - obviously that's a "definite" exception.

But for the misguided doing a disservice to their animals on a different scale - I am beginning to feel differently. I feel a lot more vocal. Why "shouldnt" I speak up, to offer them a different viewpoint, as tactfully as I can.
Is this what you do?

[mafiaprincess]

I'm a theatre student.. I have this bad tendancy where I talk to everyone..

To the point where my friends think I was previously friends with store clerks and stuff...

I offer advice.. that generally isn't asked for, as tactfully as possible. Like when someone is hemming over food, and seems lost.. I'll point in the direction of the nutro aisle.. and tell them why it's better, or point out that that shampoo made my dog smell like it rolled in something dead, and that this one, all she's gotten for 3 months is compliments on her coat..

But, I also keep my mouth shut depending... like the dude who wanted to breed his huge non breed standard chocolate lab with a poodle... though the dog is badly behaved and dumb as a post.. probably from the lack of training, and bad social manners. I couldn't come up with a nice way to say oh god please no.

But, a few weeks ago when I overheard a convo in Petsmart where an AM told a chick to not take her husky pup to obedience school, cause they will never learn and it's a waste, I did explode. Told her to tether the dog in the yard for life..

[Lissa]

In the past I have also tried to let it go and ignore certain "ridiculous" comments such as:
- "I don't spayed my dog(s) because they don't live as long, the same with humans eh?"
or in situations where the owner wants their dog to eliminate IMMEDIATELY right outside the house, and are frustrated (sometimes physical) when they don't. The dog I'm reffering to is now 5 years old and has only ever been walked 8 feet to go to the bathroom, it lives in a crate, where the owners are chain-smokers and never air out the house. I've had the duty of caring for their dog - it needs 6 walks a day because it is not house trained and you can't walk it farther than 8 feet because it collapses with exhaustion.
I am sure we all have tons of situations where we are like "I weep for the future".
But I have started to say things when I think that something needs to be done/changed. Unless we all keep trying to change and educate people it will never happen. We also can't be too cynical with people when we try to "set them right" - even though we see the same dumb acts occuring everyday. We need to each do our part to make people and society more pet friendly.

Melissa

[nymph]

That's exactly what I do, but I get viciously attacked: verbally of course.

People don't want to hear about it, they think they are doing the best for their pets. I just had this MAJOR debate with a whole bunch of younger kids who don't believe in spay/neuter, or that buying a pet from a pet store is more than OK. "Where else would I be able to find a pet?" they asked. People got so pissed off at me for telling them something they don't want to hear.

I think it's no use, you can't really convince people based on arguments and supporting facts, people would only believe what they would want to believe, and not the real facts. People would get resentful and defensive, meanwhile the real message would get lost in the process.

Right now, I try to look the other way and only offer my advice if I sense that someone would actually listen, and I start off easy too, trying to hide my claws. I still explode from time to time.

[raingirl]

Originally Posted by mafiaprincess

I'm a theatre student.. I have this bad tendancy where I talk to everyone..

To the point where my friends think I was previously friends with store clerks and stuff...

I offer advice.. that generally isn't asked for, as tactfully as possible. Like when someone is hemming over food, and seems lost.. I'll point in the direction of the nutro aisle.. and tell them why it's better, or point out that that shampoo made my dog smell like it rolled in something dead, and that this one, all she's gotten for 3 months is compliments on her coat..

But, I also keep my mouth shut depending... like the dude who wanted to breed his huge non breed standard chocolate lab with a poodle... though the dog is badly behaved and dumb as a post.. probably from the lack of training, and bad social manners. I couldn't come up with a nice way to say oh god please no.

But, a few weeks ago when I overheard a convo in Petsmart where an AM told a chick to not take her husky pup to obedience school, cause they will never learn and it's a waste, I did explode. Told her to tether the dog in the yard for life..

This reminded me of the other day when I was in super pet. There was a lady looking for Performatin food. She obviously wasn't the pets owner, probably a relative trying to help out or something. She even had a list. She kept looking at the list, walking up and down the isles. Part of me wanted to tell her that Performatin was the Pet Valu brand...but I wanted to watch her ask a store person. Unfortunately, my BF was ready to go, so I didn't get to see what happened. I could of told her...but didn't feel like it.

[SnowDancer]

Picture this. I was waiting to cross Danforth near Chester - the light is very slow. A couple in their 20s - "yuppy" in appearance were beside me as were a few other people. The man saw a small poodle across the street and stated quite loudly "Now there is a dog that should be put in a microwave". And his companion agreed. The other bystanders looked stricken and afraid to say anything. I, however, was not. When I am seriously angry I respond quietly but to the point - plus I have eyes like a hound dog - I get my meaning across. He jumped back a bit. I do not care for microwaves and do not have one. My main reason for not having one is that until last year I had mini Dachshunds and I know I do not need to repeat the horror stories of small dogs and microwaves. Perhaps this guy was one of the perpetrators.

[raingirl]

small dogs and micorwaves?? Did I miss something? Are microwaves bad for small dogs??

[Eleni]

no small dogs fit in microwaves, and unfortunatly there are soe cruel enough to put dogs in micrwaves.

i wont explain further as i sure you can peice it together from there

Eleni

[raingirl]

wow. Never heard of someone putting a dog in a microwave before.

[chico2]

To hubbies horror I talk to anyone,anywhere...basically a buddinsky
If it has to do with animals in any way,I certainly will intervene..I'm not to concerned with what the culprit thinks of me

[CyberKitten]

Sadly, there was a pet abuse case in Florida where a bf - upset at his gf - put her cat in a microwave. NOT a pretty picture, pretty grisely actually! Ughhh!!

For me, it tends to depend on the situation. I get paid to give advice so as an occupational hazard, I sometimes forget and give it where it is not wanted, lol I have recomemnded to many many people NOT to declaw their cats for example. And if I see an animal being abused or neglected, I would call the authorities. I have had to testify and told people they were abusing their children as part of my work and that can be nasty - to the point of threatening. If I see some 250 pound guy who looks mean abusing his dog, I am likley to call the police or SPCA (I know - it may take awhile but my tackling him will solve nothing). If, on the other hand, some person who looks less threatening is say dragging a puppy the wrong way, or hits her dog/cat/ small animal, I would not hesitate to tell her she is breaking the law. I have no qualms about giving people advice about pet food in a store - especially if they are picking up the cheap store brand.

And speaking of advice. Re: "Picture this. I was waiting to cross Danforth near Chester"

I have no earthy idea what either of those streets-avenues-lanes-whatever, look like so how can I picture it? When you write something, you need to explain in terms people understand or else you do not get your point across. (I am forever explaining this to some of my students who like to use large words when a smaller, better understood one will suffice - they may be demonstrating the new wonderful vocabulary they are learning but their objective of informing people and/or advocating an issue is totally lost. <g>

Keep in mind the internet is a global network and you'll do fine! Or were you just speaking to people who live in the city where those streets exist and the rest of us do not count? (I assume Toronto since your info says you are from there). I hope that is not the case but if you want to start a thread for Torontonians, I guess that could occur - I don't know. There is one for rescuing cats from Montreal so anything is possible I guess.

[kandy]

I would absolutely say something. My husband always tells me that I stick my nose where it doesn't belong - but he has always avoided confrontation at any cost and I've never been real worried about it. Maybe if I get hit one of these times - I might think twice (while the hitter was in jail for assault! ). I've told pet owners how to handle their animals better (even took one in for a couple of weeks to prove to the owners that he could be better behaved); I've told friends when I saw their husbands out with someone else; I put a note on a car when I saw a guy hit it and then take off (I got his license number). So, yeah, I'm basically a nosey person who will say what I think, no matter the consequences. I don't say things to be mean - I just say what I think and sometimes people don't like that.

[LittleLoves]

Who am I to tell someone the right way to do something, or to point out how ridiculous their ideas on training/raising/disciplining their dog is? As a parent, I would not appreciate someone I don't know giving me their opinion on how to raise my child, and I see it no differently with pets. I would appreciate gentle suggestions perhaps, but certainly not someone I don't know trying to "correct" me. I suppose it all depends on approach and tone of voice though...if you don't have a "you're a moron" face as you give a suggestion or idea, go ahead.

If there is abuse...most certainly speak up and take action, but if it's just a stupid pet owner it's not really your place.

[Karin]

I can get very vocal when I see a parent outside of a grocery store making their children peddle free puppies & kittens from a box to the shoppers going in.
AND.... The gadzillion "bubba's" in redneckville here hate to pull up next to me in a parking lot with their dogs riding in the bed of the pickemup truck. Bubba get's an earful too.

Too bad there is no dumbass vaccine.

[Shamrock]

Littleloves, that is what I have always felt as well...'who am I to challenge another?
On the other hand..while this once seemed the politically correct thing to do,( dont get involved) society now in general is much more vocal, I find.

Its seems it's now politically incorrect to NOT speak up. (with diplomacy if possible)

[LittleLoves]

Yes...it now seems politically incorrect to keep your mouth shut. lol

I really do think the key in "educating" someone else is to make sure they are receptive, and then to do it in a manner that isn't pushy or
condescending. <--- is that even spelled properly??

[mafiaprincess]

If I'm cranky, I'm not very helpful, but I love my pup, and like to see people doing good things for theirs..

I'm not about to go tell someone to go to a pet food store to buy a way better brand of food than what a place like petsmart sells.. I'm happy if people want advice, and a step up from something like iams can rock my socks.

Heck, one night with Cider I was asked by 6 different people in half an hour for advice. Apparently they all thought I worked there because I was working on training.

Confrontation doesn't bother me... I can be pretty scary when someone is beign a complete loser to me, but I don't care to have something like a breeding debate in public. Too messy.

[Prin]

If I am at my dog park, I speak a ton. Lately I have been going to another one because ours is closed for seeding, and there, I don't know anybody or who everybody is, so I don't say so much unless it's a health thing or a safety thing.

The other (pretty hot) day, a guy was trying to get his beagle to not drink at the park (I don't know why..) and he picked up the dog by the ears with one hand and smacked him with the other. It makes me cringe to see that. I mean there is discipline and then there is plain abuse.

I tell anybody if their dog is bleeding, limping, or even has an ear infection.

Or I speak up about are for safety- like take your leash off before coming in the park because dogs on leashes are more aggressive or you'd better stop your dog's humping before everyone in the park gets aggressive. Stuff like that.

Little girls often ask me what it is like having two dogs because they want one... I say "Well, it's fun but at Christmastime, I have to walk my dogs before I open my presents. Can you imagine that?" If you tell a kid they have to walk the dog in the rain, they don't care. But before Christmas presents? Are you kidding?

People (A LOT) also ask me if Boo is Jemma's mother , just because he is bigger. Or if they are Mira dogs because they are black.

[doggy lover]

I must be a bitch because I can't keep my mouth shut, my husband walks away and leaves me when I start. Some people are so stupid you just have to say something, I can't help myself. I think I have gotten worse lately must be midlife crises.

[SarahLynn123]

Originally Posted by doggy lover

I must be a bitch because I can't keep my mouth shut

I wish. by the time I have everything worked out in my head, then work up the nerve to say something the moment is gone and I regret it forever :sad:

Maybe one day I will find my courage!!!

[Shamrock]

lol.. Doggy lover! Well, silence speaks too, doesnt it?

A woman from a cat group I visit is soliticing a purebred cat from a person rehoming and has arranged to have it delivered to her home.
I felt quite ill to read this.
This person is an incompetent pet caretaker - I wouldnt trust her with a goldfish.
By her own admission -she's had four young cats in five years - two of those are dead. The reasons she stated were cancer and poisoning.
She's not able to afford vet care, and was all set to have yet another one euthanized as a "solution" to its illness. She "guessed" it might be cancer.. but whatever it was, she couldnt test or treat it -killing it the only answer.
A rescue stepped in, (that her neighbour had to call) drove out and got it,saving its life. They treated it and rehomed her The illness? Fleas. Over time and left untreated, the poor thing had become extremely sick.


Though this is technically not my "business" - I sent a message to the person and pleaded with them NOT to give their precious cat to this woman - and listed why.
She has no knowldege of the background- but I do, and feel obligated to warn her that this is NOT a good prospect.

Then - I sent "her" a message too -asking where the kitten was that she was given last summer and why does she want to receive pets when she doesnt have the rescources available to ensure they remain healthy?
They may both tell me to MYOB... Let them.
Though this was just online...not a face to face disclosure, I intend to start "biting the bullet " a whole lot less than I have been and speaking up when I feel strongly that I "should". I would always use tact and good judgement of course.
There are some people who one look tells you not to approach.

[nymph]

Originally Posted by LittleLoves

I really do think the key in "educating" someone else is to make sure they are receptive, and then to do it in a manner that isn't pushy or
condescending. <--- is that even spelled properly??

I totally agree. However you'll have to have the right attitude first: be informative but not judgemental. People could get offended easily, and oftentimes I find that because we are all animal lovers, we are much more acutely aware of improper behaviors in other pet owners: things that may not even occur to them matter to us. I don't know if I'm making myself clear, allow me to go to the other side of the fence for a moment: I've just been made aware that the feeding dishes play a role in the dog's health, leanred that yesterday. At first I thought: "wow, this is too much!", but then I realized that it made a lot of sense. Now if a stranger points that out to me, I'd probably get defensive or even resentful as well.

Be informative but not judgemental. I feel that's the best I can do.

[Shamrock]

Nymph, that is totally right.
If you start "preaching" to another on any topic, you've generally lost them. None us are very receptive to information given in a judgemental or condesending manner. Especially if the advice wasnt sought

[chico2]

Well,as you get older,the shyness some of us had when we were young,goes away and you are no more afraid to speak your mind.
I remember a neighbor a couple of houses away,kept a little white Scottie in the garage,pretty well 24/7,never cuddled him,never walked him,every day I saw him,it bothered me to the point where I felt sick for the poor little dog.
Hubbie said,don't say anything MYOB it's their dog!
Of course I had to do something and told them(the husband)how I felt,unfortunately for the dog,it was not a good outcome.. :sad:
I asked the daughter in the family about her dog and she said it had been stolen out of the garage in the night.....Yeah,right!!!
So inadvertedly I caused this little sweethearts death.....but maybe he is better off :sad:

[Prin]

Well,as you get older,the shyness some of us had when we were young,goes away and you are no more afraid to speak your mind.

Uh-oh Chico-- what does that mean for me? Am I gonna be walking around naked when I get old?

I wish. by the time I have everything worked out in my head, then work up the nerve to say something the moment is gone and I regret it forever

SarahLynn-- the moment is never gone. It takes more courage to bring it back, but it really is never gone. There are so many unnecessary rules about communication, it's nutty. Really, like anybody who has ever thought "Maybe if I say this s/he'll think I'm weird", I just don't get that. Maybe I don't care enough about what people think, but if I have something to say, I say it (have you noticed?). Ever notice how most conflicts in life are a result of misunderstandings? If everyone communicated, it' might not be so bad. As long as you are not out to hurt anyone, nothing bad can come out of communication.

[nymph]

chico2: that's so sad!

It's really tough for us to not show any emotions when we see a pet suffering, but bear in mind that different people have different ideas, it's all about respect. While your neighbor probably doesn't deserve your respect, but in order to get your message effectively across, you should try to remain calm and only focus the facts. Oftentimes it's not what you say but how you say it. Of course some people just don't care, in that case, I'd seek other means to correct the improper behaviors, like calling animal control.

I'm not criticizing you here, I think you did the right thing, poor little guy is perhaps in a much better place now.

[nymph]

Originally Posted by Prin

As long as you are not out to hurt anyone, nothing bad can come out of communication.

Oh yes, ineffective communication is worse than silence, IMHO. I've learned it the hard way.

[chico2]

Nymph,believe me,I will never be rude..but sure,if someone wants to argue,especially regarding a little dog,I am up for it.
I do not yell and scream,often it is better to calmly put the person to shame for doing what he is doing,except in this case it did not work :sad:
I did go the normal route talked to HS,but as long as the dog has food and shelter,it's all that is required..HS does not agree,but legally there is not much they can do.

[chico2]

Prin,spare us that thought
The difference is,when you are a young woman,you do not go up to a confused young man and ask if he wants help with the grocery-list,that will be a come-on
Now in my later years,I can do and say pretty well what I want,but I do however keep my clothes on

[nymph]

Originally Posted by chico2

Nymph,believe me,I will never be rude..but sure,if someone wants to argue,especially regarding a little dog,I am up for it.
I do not yell and scream,often it is better to calmly put the person to shame for doing what he is doing,except in this case it did not work :sad:
I did go the normal route talked to HS,but as long as the dog has food and shelter,it's all that is required..HS does not agree,but legally there is not much they can do.

Oh yeah? Shame on the HS!

I don't however quite agree with putting the person to shame for doing what he's doing though. In the Chinese culture, you'd never ever want to make the person "lose face". It's a fine line and I'm often struggling with it too. I guess my idea is to make the person be aware of the problem, and realize it on him OWN how shameful he should be; otherwise I'm afraid that it's only going to create resentment, and resentment often makes the person go to the other extreme.