[cassiek]

Originally Posted by bendyfoot

And if they're not trolls? If they're just someone who's misinformed but actually cares about their pet, not knowing (because they haven't been educated) that their actions/decisions may not be in their pet's best interests? I think if someone suspects a poster is a troll, they should refrain from replying all together. If they don't ignore, I think they should park the hostility at the door and provide helpful information.

Originally Posted by BenMax

I know I for one have learned tons of information on Pets. There is always room to grow and learn.

To be honest with you, and even though there is plenty of information out there on spay and neutering, over-population, gas chambers, lethal injections and the other mulitiple ways of destroying lives..if you don't ask questions, then alot of people really don't know.

Animals are 'property' in the eyes of the law. Because of this, we can avoid responsibility because property has a decreased value once purchased. You can dispose and do whatever you want with it, even though it lives and breaths. Until this mentality is convinced otherwise, people will still purchase from petstores, reproduce these creatures for profit or for the thrill of it without thinking about the consequences.

How about the costs of spay and neutering? Why is it that as important as this is, the medical community does not participate in trying to lower their darn prices to make it more accessible? The answer: Greed. Again - money is the nasty common denominator.

There are many campaigns out there to enlighten the public but again nothing that is more 'in your face'. Where are the billboards? I mean clothing companies splash half clad women on billboards to get the public's attention...where are the animal welfare campaigns? Why is it the animal food companies not trying to help out by putting a tiny bit of their profits towards educating the public? Greed.

It is going to take many many more years to educate. I fear we may not be around to see it. Our only hope is to let our children know so that they can pick up the slack and keep plugging away.

Great thread.

Originally Posted by bendyfoot

Why should they know better? I'm being serious! I considered myself to be a well-educated person AND an animal lover...but I still got a dog from a byb. I got my pets spayed/neutered because "that's what you do", not because I knew WHY it was the right thing to do. When neighbours had litters of puppies or kittens, my first reaction was "awwwwwww", not (as it is now). I didn't know better then...and why should I have? I was a new pet owner...I just did what others around me did...it seemed pretty straightforward and I had no reason to go seeking alternate opinions.

Just because WE know this stuff (now) doesn't mean we can reasonably expect everyone else to. It's simply not realistic.

I know it gets super-tiring saying the same thing over and over...for US...but for other visitors here, it may be the first time they've ever heard "the speech". If it's delivered with an honest intent to help and inform, people are way more likely to hear it. If we give "the speech"with the (however thinly veiled) intent to tell someone they're an idiot and a terrible pet owner, well...they're probably going to think "go to hell". And may not come across another potentially excellent resource like this forum.

I have to say this...there are so many people here who I admire greatly and do so much incredible work on behalf of animals that I could never even dream of doing myself, and who I generally think are pretty awesome people...but sometimes the replies I read that are given to new posters about matters of S/N, or breeding etc...well frankly it puts a very sour taste in my mouth, and makes me very uncomfortable, and well...a bit ashamed to be honest.

Originally Posted by JennieV

I happen to agree with Bendy. When I first came to this website, I wasn't very happy. I was actually feeling stupid and like a horrible pet owner. Then, as I was reading more, I started to get to know people and it was making sense. when you guys see the same stupid questions over and over - you must feel frustrated and hopeless (.".oh, great, here comes another one..") but the truth is that although I am a smart person and consider myself well-educated and knowledgeable about animals - I had NO CLUE how much info is out there! And how much suffering, an what really goes on... I never asked the questions simply because it was never in my mind. I never questioned where these cuties at the pet shop come from, and what conditions their parents are kept in etc... It boggles the mind once you are EXPOSED to it, but until then - its like an ostrich, head in the sand!
I only know all of this and am aware of what goes on and why because I stuck around long enough.
I am not saying that ya'all should sugar-coat it, but a bitter pill is hard to swallow and when a regular person (not a troll) feels under attack - they will turn and walk away and our words will fall on def ears or, rather, blind eye...
JMHO

To sum it up... education is key, but so is being tactful. This thread had taken a completely different turn, but has raised an important point: our message will no doubt fall on deaf ears if we do not reply in a polite manner. How many threads are closed because it escalates out of control? I am a new member here, and to be honest have considered leaving several times because of the hostility that comes across on the board. Sometimes it feels like a group of teenage girls and boys with the lack of maturity and name-calling and it gets old real quick. That being said, I understand 110% where the frustration comes from when you are as passionate as most of us are about these issues and keep seeing the same ol' scenario coming up again and again and again.

Certainly I have learned much more since joining Pets and did not know near the amount of information I did now until joining. I certainly think that increasingly it is becoming more common for people to spay/neuter their pets and look at rescuing instead.

We have all made mistakes - I am not trying to point anyone's out - heck I said myself I purchased a dog from a BYB and had no idea at the time that it was "bad" in anyway. As far as I was concerned, that's what people did - looked in their local newspaper and purchased a pup - not questioning anything. I always had a bad feeling about where pet store puppies/kittens came from, but to be honest it was probably something we never did more so because of the horrendous cost they charge for a mutt.

Education is the answer here. I agree that the $$ vets charge to spay/neuter is outrageously over-priced and surely deters some pet owners from fixing their pets. I know that there is programs available for those who really can not afford it for low-cost spay/neuters. It's unfortunate that the greed of major pet corporations gets in the way of what's best for our pets whether that is nutrition wise, health wise, etc. Really, it's no different than for us humans... we can not rely on organizations like the USDA, FDA, or CFIA to ensure human food safety when they are funded by the company who is trying to promote their product. We need to educate ourselves, do our research, and read the labels and not just assume they have our best interests at heart.

I guess we really can't assume people know better. I like to suggest to people who are considering breeding their pets to volunteer at their local shelter. What better way to become informed of the tragic reality then to witness first-hand the sheer number of pets that are surrendered and PTS everyday, all for a BS reason? Or return endless messages of people who can't keep their pets for a garbage reason, have a litter of puppies because of stupidity, etc.? It doesn't take long to realize how ****ty the situation is, and start to feel disgusted at how us humans treat our companions. And once you start to become informed, I think you begin to appreciate that good information is everywhere - you may have to dig a little deep for it, but it is out there. It's not an excuse anymore that there is not good information out there - it's literally at our fingertips, even if yes you do have to type a few words into the google search bar. Probably we need groups to start having a more aggressive approach towards conveying the message - along the lines of PETA, who I disagree with for several reasons, but have to admit... they get their message across loud and clear. (And before anyone freaks, I am not saying advertising naked women or graphic pictures to get a message across is necessary!).