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-   -   American Bulldog/Dogo Argentino (http://www.pets.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=74096)

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 08:57 AM

American Bulldog/Dogo Argentino
 
Hi, i just bought a 6 Week old American Bulldog mixed with a Dogo Argentino and i was wondering if any of you guys would know arround how big he can get? And let me know what you think about this kind of dog :thumbs up

Marty11 December 17th, 2010 09:29 AM

Dog experience would be great! :) You are going to have a dog 80 lbs I think maybe? I'm sure he'll be stunning. 6 weeks old your getting him? Little too soon. :(

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 09:42 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Yes i know its a bit soon, but his mother sadly got stolen not long ago :(, but ill try and give him all the attention he needs so he has a good life :)

We also bought his little sister, so they are not alone

BenMax December 17th, 2010 09:45 AM

I know both breeds very well.

Very important to ensure to keep your dog very well socialized around dogs, cats and people in general. I highly recommend puppy classes as you have a high power breed combination.

The size will be a large and muscular breed combo.

Word to the wise..if you live in a state, province or country where pitbulls and amstaffs are restricted, please make sure that the paperwork on this dog clearly reads the breeds within. Make sure that if you do not have official papers, the vet papers clearly indicate the breed. Also when licensing the dog make sure it clearly states as well. THIS is the best advise that I can give you.

Marty11 December 17th, 2010 09:47 AM

For sure "Puppy classes" Very sweet looking pups!

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 09:51 AM

Thanks Guys!

BenMax December 17th, 2010 09:56 AM

Don't disappear from this forum now... We want to hear much more about your adventures ahead.:thumbs up

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 09:59 AM

[QUOTE=BenMax;971530]Don't disappear from this forum now... We want to hear much more about your adventures ahead.:thumbs up[/QUOTE]

Haha dont worry about that, im not going nowhere, i love forums like this, and ill have plenty of questions and sugestion for you guys :laughing:

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 10:11 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Here is a picture of Bully's dad:dog:

100 Pounds Dogo Argentino :eek: Very nice dog!!!

Love4himies December 17th, 2010 10:27 AM

Now that just looks like double trouble to me :cloud9::lovestruck::cloud9::lovestruck: :laughing:


I see you are in Ontario. I hope you will heed Benmax's advice about documenting the breed of your dog. :pray:

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 10:40 AM

[QUOTE=Love4himies;971534]Now that just looks like double trouble to me :cloud9::lovestruck::cloud9::lovestruck: :laughing:


I see you are in Ontario. I hope you will heed Benmax's advice about documenting the breed of your dog. :pray:[/QUOTE]

Yes im will, im not exacly sure what this meens tho :shrug: where do i do that?

Love4himies December 17th, 2010 10:48 AM

[QUOTE=BenMax;971524]I know both breeds very well.

Very important to ensure to keep your dog very well socialized around dogs, cats and people in general. I highly recommend puppy classes as you have a high power breed combination.

The size will be a large and muscular breed combo.

Word to the wise..if you live in a state, province or country where pitbulls and amstaffs are restricted, please make sure that the paperwork on this dog clearly reads the breeds within. Make sure that if you do not have official papers, the vet papers clearly indicate the breed. Also when licensing the dog make sure it clearly states as well. THIS is the best advise that I can give you.[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=Bastien;971538]Yes im will, im not exacly sure what this meens tho :shrug: where do i do that?[/QUOTE]
See BenMax's quote above this.

I am sure you are aware that animal control can take you dogs away if they appear to look like a pitbull or pitbull mix. Without the proper documentation, ie papers from the breeder documenting who the parents are and have your vet document them as the same mixed breed, your dogs could be seized and put down :(. All thanks to Bryant and McGuinty :(:(

BenMax December 17th, 2010 11:13 AM

Good thing you are sticking around...

I assume that you are aware of the pitbull/amstaff restriction in your province. What you may not be aware of then it that ANY dog that remotely resembles one of these dogs (even if they are not) can and will be ceased and destroyed. In particular, boxer X, dogos, and American Bulldog are MISTAKEN to be pitbull and/or amstaff X. As a result, based on the standard measurement of the head, ears, eyes, shoulders or any other attribute that THEY (meaning the AC or those enforcing this stupid law) deem restricted by law, these dogs can and will be ceased and killed.

Since your pup will have these attributes, I highly suggest that you do some research and empower yourself with the knowledge. You MUST also ensure that all documentation related to this dog clearly indicates the associated breeds. Make darn sure this is done or else you are headed for some serious heartbreak.

I have moved out many dogs from Ontario that clearly were NOT restricted but because they had no documentation as to breed or type, they were either to be exiled into another province or killed.

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 12:19 PM

Ok well i looked at the papers i have for the dog, and i have some papers from the vet, for his shots, and it says Dogo Argentino/American Bulldog on them, i hope thats going to be good enough :shrug:

Stupid Laws!!!! If ever they take my dog... :censored::wall::frustrated:

BenMax December 17th, 2010 01:39 PM

Ok well this is a good start. DNA testing is available HOWEVER, if it comes up inconclusive then this is a grey area and also can lead to an unfavourable ending.

When you license your dog ensure that you bring the vetting documentation with you just in case they do not trust your word. Do not give any documentation unless they specifically ask for it. Do not divuldge any further information than this. Get in and get out.:thumbs up

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 01:45 PM

[QUOTE=BenMax;971566]Ok well this is a good start. DNA testing is available HOWEVER, if it comes up inconclusive then this is a grey area and also can lead to an unfavourable ending.

When you license your dog ensure that you bring the vetting documentation with you just in case they do not trust your word. Do not give any documentation unless they specifically ask for it. Do not divuldge any further information than this. Get in and get out.:thumbs up[/QUOTE]

Thank you sooo much! :) Lets just hope it never gets to that point, i live in the contry so i should be ok for now.

Dog Dancer December 17th, 2010 01:50 PM

Bastien, your pups are gorgeous, both of them. I sure hope that you don't run into any issues with their breed. As BM said, dogs like this are just one pen stroke away from heartbreak. It's so sad and ridiculous. Umm, feel free to post as many pics as you want to! :D

BastienBully December 17th, 2010 02:50 PM

3 Attachment(s)
[QUOTE=Dog Dancer;971574] Umm, feel free to post as many pics as you want to! :D[/QUOTE]

I will, im always taking pictures of him (btw the little one is my friends), Here is a couple more pics:

chico2 December 17th, 2010 03:43 PM

OMG,they are so sweet:lovestruck:
You should definitely heed BenMax's advice,she knows what she is talking about.

I am not experienced with dog-breeds,but looking at your puppies daddy,at first glance I would misstakingly say he was a Pit-Bull,the same could happen with your pup.:(

Love4himies December 17th, 2010 04:35 PM

Oh they are just so cute :cloud9::lovestruck:

Please do take Benmax's advice, she has had experience with this law in Ontario.

mastifflover December 17th, 2010 04:38 PM

OMG I have died and gone to puppy heaven. Great breeds and definitely heed Benmax's warnings. I have an AB too but mine is the type that looks more boxer bulldog. You have the type who people stupidly say it looks like a Pit or Staff and since Dogos have that same look people assume before they know or have even heard of a Dogo. I personally love anything Mastiff and they are great but always make sure that you have there respect not by aggression but by positive reinforcement. Having owned Mastiffs and now an AB they can be stubborn as mules. But yelling at them or even trying to be alpha with them can backfire on you. The worst punishment you can inflict is ignoring them this is devastating to them. They truly are velcro dogs. We will be expecting lots of pics of these cuties. Welcome to the board

totallyhip December 17th, 2010 05:37 PM

Adorable!

erykah1310 December 17th, 2010 06:04 PM

If that picture is of the dad, the father is the american bulldog, Dogos are only white.

Cute pups though, but they will get labeled as "Pitbulls" sadly.
No matter how much paper work your vet gives you on the actual mix of the pups, or the "breeder" stating anything, unless there are registration papers they can be seized and euthanized.
Its not up to the vet/breeder/owner to state what breed the dogs in Ontario are, final descision is made by a judge.
Also, the law does hide behind, "substantially similar" as well.

luckypenny December 17th, 2010 06:45 PM

Your pups are truly beautiful but, I can't help but feel an overwhelming sense of anxiety for their future in Ontario. Seeing they were removed much too young from their littermates and mom, I was going to suggest a puppy socialization class asap. Only problem is, is it would take only one complaint and they'd be in serious trouble. Doesn't matter if you live in the country, someone is going to see them eventually.

I'm with erykah, a certificate from the breeder or vet would do no good. I question the motives of the person who bred the parents as well. Who would do something like that knowing what the laws in Ontario are and risking these dogs' lives :shrug:?

erykah1310 December 17th, 2010 06:55 PM

Lucky Penny, it is happening a lot here, breeding breeds together that will have the resemblance of a bully. Boxer and anything mixes, cane corso boxer mixes, dogo x something smaller, jack russel or parsons russel to boxer ect... then you still have your bully breeding going on right in the cities and on MANY reserves. Its very sad.

luckypenny December 17th, 2010 07:04 PM

That's just beyond irresponsible. And so sad.

erykah1310 December 17th, 2010 11:47 PM

Since they became illegal, there is a HUGE market for them now, even using the word market makes my stomach clench up but sadly to these people that is what it is.
You have to watch the "American bull dog" ads now since kijiji will no longer list Dogo's, "pitbulls" or Am.Staffs for sale unless from a reputable rescue. People know when they are seeing ads for American bull dogs with no papers, they know they are inquiring about "pitbulls".
In the next town over from us there is a woman doing this, I believe this is where elmo came from origionally since i creeped her facebook ( she doesnt know how to set privacy settings) and there was a pup in her photo albums that HAS to be Elmo.
She just had another litter, there are a lot of us scratching our heads trying to figure out what we should do. Report her? and know that the pups and parents will be killed or ???? I personally wouldnt want to know that because of me a litter of innocent pups dies because I reported her, but on the other hand, if we did report her we could save countless lives. Still she will just start up again.
Like I said, when I'm working on reservations now every second house has a "pitbull" or two where they didnt before.

Sorry to thread jack so badly Bastien, this is the world that you are now going to get very familiar with though just because of what your cutie pies may slightly resemble.

BastienBully December 20th, 2010 03:01 PM

[QUOTE=erykah1310;971606]If that picture is of the dad, the father is the american bulldog, Dogos are only white.[/QUOTE]

I know that dogo's are only white, but ive seen the odd one with a bit of black and was purebreed dogo with papers :shrug: maybe the dad is not 100% pure tho.... but thats what the breader said. And on the papers to.

Im not saying your wrong lol Thanks :)

BastienBully December 20th, 2010 03:03 PM

Thanks everyone for your inputs and comments, ill make sure to get the papers for my dog :thumbs up

BenMax December 20th, 2010 03:56 PM

[QUOTE=luckypenny;971618]I'm with erykah, a certificate from the breeder or vet would do no good. I question the motives of the person who bred the parents as well. Who would do something like that knowing what the laws in Ontario are and risking these dogs' lives :shrug:?[/QUOTE]

This is not entirely true LP. I have pulled many dogs from Ontario that otherwise would have been ok had the breeders papers or the vetting paperwork stated that they were X breed. I have also spoken to several animal control officers pleading with them to recognize the dog as a mix of anything but amstaff or pit. Their answer was clear...get me medical documents or breeding papers to prove it. This was brought to me on more than one occasion.

However, in the end yes you are right in a way,.. and it does not take a judge to say what lives or dies, it's animal control UNLESS it goes to court.

It is better to have something than nothing. I think empowering this person is better than discouraging something that has already happened. The OP really should be getting as much paperwork as possible to show what breed mix his dogs are before going out in public in my opinion.

erykah1310 December 20th, 2010 04:11 PM

[QUOTE=BenMax;972069]

It is better to have something than nothing. I think empowering this person is better than discouraging something that has already happened. The OP really should be getting as much paperwork as possible to show what breed mix his dogs are before going out in public in my opinion.[/QUOTE]

Nobody is discouraging, I think its VERY important for anyone who "could" fall into this rediculous law to be absolutely fully aware of what "could" happen.
And yes the OP absolutely should be arming himself with as much information on these pups as possible in the even they are ever questioned. All it takes is one person to cry "Pitbull" so even if it meant walking around with a brief case of paperwork stating other wise so that it never ends up in court all bases should be covered.

BenMax December 21st, 2010 08:50 AM

[QUOTE=erykah1310;972076]Nobody is discouraging, I think its VERY important for anyone who "could" fall into this rediculous law to be absolutely fully aware of what "could" happen.
And yes the OP absolutely should be arming himself with as much information on these pups as possible in the even they are ever questioned. All it takes is one person to cry "Pitbull" so even if it meant walking around with a brief case of paperwork stating other wise so that it never ends up in court all bases should be covered.[/QUOTE]

:thumbs up. Thank you Erykah. I just wanted to state that it is very important that everyone is equipped in everyway possible to ensure the safety of their pets. There has been times when I get a call from rescue(s) or reps from shelters in Ontario for assistance to help remove quietly an animal because the owners were not aware of the risks involved when there was no paper trail to clearly indicate the breeds within. Even at that (and you and LP are correct) it is not fool proof. It really depends on those enforcing this law to deem whether or not the dog is of the restricted 'type'. Regardless, it is better to have everything in order and not only when or if the dog is ceased. This leads to suspicion and then there will be reason for AC to remove the said animal from their loving owners.

BastienBully December 22nd, 2010 12:01 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Another pic of my little guy :lovestruck:

BenMax December 22nd, 2010 12:05 PM

Absolutely stunning.:lovestruck:.

mastifflover December 22nd, 2010 02:19 PM

Well he has the head tilt down. In other word how cute am I? Incredibly cute

Longblades December 23rd, 2010 08:32 AM

Apart from the possible resemblance to a banned breed another care you must take is with two puppies the same age. Rearing two at once is more than twice the work of one. This is because you should take care to work with them one on one and do much of their training separately. This is even more of a concern with the temperament you may expect to find in your chosen breeds, they need to be very thoroughly socialized and habituated and they will need much of these as individuals, not as a pair. As a pair the danger is they will bond more to each other than to you. For this reason many, many breeders will not allow puppies to go as pairs to a purchaser.

Dogos are not recognized in Canada so there is no Canadian standard. The FCI standard says this about colour: [QUOTE]COLOR : Completely white; only one black or dark coloured patch around the eye may be admitted, provided that it does not cover more than 10% of the head. Between two dogs of equal conformation, the judge should always choose the whiter one[/QUOTE]

I also think the photo of "Dad" looks more like the Am. Bulldog. Benmax? Opinions?

Cutie-pie puppies. Oh so cute.

BenMax December 23rd, 2010 09:00 AM

[QUOTE=Longblades;972534]Apart from the possible resemblance to a banned breed another care you must take is with two puppies the same age. Rearing two at once is more than twice the work of one. This is because you should take care to work with them one on one and do much of their training separately. This is even more of a concern with the temperament you may expect to find in your chosen breeds, they need to be very thoroughly socialized and habituated and they will need much of these as individuals, not as a pair. As a pair the danger is they will bond more to each other than to you. For this reason many, many breeders will not allow puppies to go as pairs to a purchaser.

Dogos are not recognized in Canada so there is no Canadian standard. The FCI standard says this about colour:

I also think the photo of "Dad" looks more like the Am. Bulldog. Benmax? Opinions?

Cutie-pie puppies. Oh so cute.[/QUOTE]

Well Longblades, I did not want to say anything...but yes..the father in my opinion is an Amercian Bulldog. Having one at one time and also placing 3 dogos..I have become very familiar with the looks and traits. So yes, like you I see American Bulldog.

Also, as you stated, and something very important to point out is the fact that these dogs will require one on one training and need to bond with their human more than with each other. This breed or breed combo is highly sensitive and must have direction and LOTS of socialization with everything possible such as dogs of all sizes. When they get to maturity, having a dog like this that is unruly is a complete nightmare. Having 2 - well double the nightmare as they will feed off one another. This is definately a huge undertaking but with guideance, training and determination it is workable.

BastienBully December 23rd, 2010 09:37 AM

I understand what you guys are saying, but Bully is mine and Brooklyn(littlegirl) is my friends, they just sleep and spend the morning together, when im done work i go and get him. They get individual attention and training. The reason hes staying at my friends, is because i am not allowed a dog where i live, but im moving out soon.

And for the dogo part, i understand what you guys are saying, maybe the breader is wrong about the Dad, or maybe he is a Dogo/AM Bulldog mix and the mom AM Bulldog. :shrug:

And on another note: My cousin just baught Bully's other sister, so they will be able to play all together :)

BenMax December 23rd, 2010 10:13 AM

Regardless of whatever breed is within your pup, he is absolutely gorgeous. Just keep the dog well socialized and well trained. We in rescue see too many lovely dogs euthanized because owners do not take full responsibility in ensuring their dogs are well trained. Some people believe that dogs require little exercise and socialization..their dogs get minimum. As a result, they abandon their animals and many are unnecessarily euthanized. When you own a power breed one must understand and be responsible in ensuring that they have well adjusted pups and adults. This is the key to having harmony with your furbabes.

BastienBully December 23rd, 2010 10:30 AM

I try and get my pup to socialize as much as i can, I bring him twice a week at my dads, where he has 2 mignature shnauwzers to play wit, about three times a week at my friends house, she has 2 Boxers and a cat, and at my uncles once in a while where he can play wit my little cousins :)

I want him to be good with other dogs, and expecialy wit humans (kids):thumbs up

I weighted him last night and he is now 12pds at 8 Weeks old if i got the readings right lol


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